r/whatsthisworth • u/ico59 • Sep 30 '23
Inherited this ring from my Grandpa over 20 years ago. Was told he got it while fighting in WW2. Any idea what it might be? LIKELY SOLVED
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u/B-SideToho Sep 30 '23 edited Sep 30 '23
OP, it appears to be 18kt gold with a diamond. Other than that, it's difficult to tell anything more without seeing hallmarks or any subtle design elements. A quick Google search only tells me that it was a rather popular design during the Victorian era, with several variations. Are there any stamps on the inside of the ring shank?
Edit: I found this
Yours was very well loved and most of the fine detail has worn away, but comparing the opening behind the stones in both rings, I think this is what it originally looked like.
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u/ico59 Sep 30 '23 edited Sep 30 '23
Wow amazing. No marks or anything on the inside to see. I may take it to a jeweler just to see if they can add anything on to this as well. Updating this comment for backstory: Grandpa was a Jewish American fighting for the US. I think he was stationed in Europe. I got the ring when I was in middle school and didn’t think to ask my grandma the story behind it. I don’t really have any family left that could fill me in either, so I don’t think I can get much more info on the backstory.
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u/B-SideToho Sep 30 '23
Look for a jeweler that specializes in estate jewelry. They usually get vintage and antique pieces and may be able to provide more info. Judging by how much wear is on the outside of the ring, there may be some very worn marks you can't see with the naked eye on the inside that they can magnify. Good luck!
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u/TututniDreamer Oct 01 '23
To answer where that comes from, it is the ring awarded to Luftwaffe pilots and officers (sort of the same thing, perhaps better to say pilot's officers). A diamond in the mouth, is like a tier for awardees, as well as its gold casting. They came most commonly in silver, with gem tiers most commonly featuring a ruby in the mouth; and to my knowledge, their award was somewhat arbitrary from feats in battle or command. The most common silver lion's head rings were also found amongst the rank and file as they found the imagery of the lion meaningful and sought to emulate the heroes of the Luftwaffe and nazi command.
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u/myphton Sep 30 '23
Based on a bit of research... new rings of a similar design and diamond embedment go anywhere from $2500 to $5000. I'm curious to know what this particular piece would be.
But if it were me? I wouldn't sell it. Ever.
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u/Smackjabber Sep 30 '23
This! Especially if it was a ring worn by someone that killed a Nazi. If it was from a dead Nazi, then I'd keep it as a trophy of my family and pass it on. Either way I'd never ever get rid of it unless to pass it on.
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u/be4u4get Sep 30 '23
You can have it appraised by a jeweler. Even if you keep it you might want to know a true value.
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u/itsweedindeed Oct 01 '23
I have one that is very similar, that was passed down to me from my grandfather, who was also in WWll
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u/packref Sep 30 '23
Lions head ring, been a popular design forever. I am a jeweler and I still make at least 2 a year of similar style.
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u/packref Sep 30 '23
FYI: find a local hand engraver and they can likely restore the worn pattern in the band and deepen the lines in the face.
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u/Specific_Rest_3140 Oct 01 '23
Vintage 14k yellow Italian gold ring of a lion's head with a stunning bezel set round brilliant cut in its mouth with two accent diamonds as its eyes.
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u/RollandHill Oct 01 '23
Thank you for answering the question, instead of making a dumbass pun.
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u/daroon2 Oct 01 '23
Fr all the people who make jokes in threads like these are insufferable
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u/Curiouser-Quriouser Oct 01 '23
Yeah I know right?!
Unless they're really funny, though. Then it's okay.
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u/R1CHQK Oct 01 '23
I hate how none of the comments take this seriously. OP, are there any stamps on this ring?
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u/ico59 Sep 30 '23 edited Sep 30 '23
Just want to add my grandfather was an American Jew who fought in the war. He died when I was young so I don’t know the story behind it. No on really left for me to ask family wise as well.
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u/BENOdiction Oct 01 '23
If he was Jewish, the lion could symbolize his ancestral heritage within the Tribe of Judah. At the end of Genesis (specifically Chapter 49), Jacob, then named Israel, pronounces blessings and oracles over his children prior to his death. The first and relevant half of his blessing is:
“Judah, your brothers will praise you; your hand will be on the neck of your enemies; your father’s sons will bow down to you. 9 You are a lion’s cub, Judah; you return from the prey, my son. Like a lion he crouches and lies down, like a lioness—who dares to rouse him? 10 The scepter will not depart from Judah, nor the ruler’s staff from between his feet, until he to whom it belongs[d] shall come and the obedience of the nations shall be his.”
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u/WangCommander Oct 01 '23
Lions Head rings were popular with german military men in WW2.
It's a war trophy.
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u/Conscious-Lab6441 Sep 30 '23
This is a really cool ring, definitely rare enough to belong in a museum. Theres really low quality ones selling for like 200-500$ so i imagine that would sell for wayyyyy more
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u/Olleye Sep 30 '23
Maybe from the „Golden Lions“, the 106th Infantry Division of the US Army.
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u/Aggressive-Poetry838 Oct 01 '23
Obv one of seven given to the dwarf lords in their halls of stone. Sources say to check the elves for 3 more, 9 were given to mortal men doomed to die, and one made for a dark lord on his dark throne. /s
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u/avantartist Oct 01 '23
Looks kinda like this: https://www.pamono.com/18-karat-yellow-gold-lion-ring-with-diamond-france-1900s see a few similar 1900’s from France
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u/Robpaulssen Oct 01 '23
Probably took it off a nazi corpse, your grandpa was probably a badass
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u/GloomyDeal1909 Oct 01 '23
So my brother owns a golf ring with a black opal in the center.
It was taken off a dead Nazi soldier that a relative killed. When my brother was born it was given to my parents as a birth gift. He kept it in a drawer for years.
None of us found out until my brother was in his. Teens that it was a dead Nazi soldiers ring.
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u/brevans Oct 01 '23
What's a "golf ring"?
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u/Turbulent_Advance836 Sep 30 '23
That is a classic Lannister ring…..it’s priceless
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u/Latter-Ad-8139 Sep 30 '23
The 106th or the "Golden Lions" fought in WW2 in both Europe and Africa. Maybe he was with them. Cool keepsake nonetheless.
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u/icinr Sep 30 '23
Which side was he fighting for?
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u/ico59 Sep 30 '23
Jewish American . I think in the paratroopers.
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u/Glad-Day-724 Sep 30 '23
Research the real life WWII inspiration for "The Dirty Dozen" and possibly "Inglorious Bastards" too.
James Elbert "Jake" McNiece was a special man! He was also called Jake McNasty!
Heavily decorated, BUT he was never promoted above Private!!! He was "Acting First Sargent" and even paid as First Sargent, but he was still a Private!
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u/Holiday_Ad1403 Sep 30 '23
Looks like it’s from that era but I’d almost say that the gem was added at a later time, because his teeth are gone.
https://www.liveauctioneers.com/price-result/wwii-german-third-reich-lion-head-silver-ring/
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u/treatyrself Sep 30 '23
RIPPPPPPP as soon as he said WW2 i was worried it was a nazi thing 💀
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u/foolforfucks Sep 30 '23
Only a jeweler can tell you for sure. That looks like at least 18k gold (often stamped inside the band). The quality of the diamond needs tools to assess. It might also have a maker's mark in the band somewhere that can give more details.
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u/HermitBadger Sep 30 '23
Completely ignores potential historical value. On the other hand, OPs grandad could have bought it in Australia circa July 1945. 🤷🏻♂️
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u/LivingMemento Sep 30 '23
It was bought in whatever town he was stationed in when he saw it or dreamt it up. It’s 18k. 14k was a metal that only Americans really got into
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u/javajuicejoe Sep 30 '23
How did he get it? Intrigued to know the story behind this. Nice ring.
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u/ico59 Sep 30 '23
I wish I could ask. Got it after he passed as a kid. Didn’t think to ask my grandma in my youth. I don’t have any family left that I could ask either so might not be able to find out the story.
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u/MojoJojoSF Oct 01 '23
Most likely French, die struck, turn of the century. Meaning a steel hub carving that they drop hammer the gold into. I work with vintage dies today and a very similar lion die was for sale the other day. Kitty’s nose has worn down.
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u/CaliforniaNavyDude Sep 30 '23
Looks like grandpa pulled it off of some dead Nazi. You've got what they call in the biz a "trophy". Or in the parlance of of our times, "loot drop."
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u/takenbymistaken Sep 30 '23
My uncle in his late 60’s is in Germany and loves gold lion jewelry. It may be a German thing.
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u/captainmouse86 Sep 30 '23
Lions are a major symbol of Monarchy and the families of Germany/Austria/Bavaria were no different; lions dot symbols of German History and Family Arms. There’s a specific lion symbol called the Palatine Lion and dates back to use by families/counts, to at least the 1200’s and likely older. If you Google the image, you’ll recognize it. It’s very common on Beer steins.
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u/yetiking77 Oct 01 '23
There are four others just like it, when all five are combined you can form Voltron.
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Oct 01 '23
In which side your grandpa fought for, OP? If he was a German soldier, your family possibility has some skeletons in the closet.
If he fought for the Allies, he probably cut off from the finger of a nazi general he beat to death after drink too much vodka (at least I’d tell people that).
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u/kellen617 Sep 30 '23
Grandpa pulled that off a dead guy
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u/military-gradeAIDS Sep 30 '23
How was your Grandpa's extended vacation to Argentina?
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u/JasonFurious4 Sep 30 '23
I've seen enough sorcerers apprentice to know what these rings are capable of
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u/Minty-licious Sep 30 '23
Spoils of war. That's the origin of ur ring
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u/VoodooSweet Sep 30 '23
My grandfather fought in WW2, he had all kinds of crazy stories, but it was a well known “family secret” that he had sent home all kinds of expensive “spoils of war” and that’s how after he got home, he bought a Bar in a local city, owned it for like 5 years and then sold it and retired for the rest of his life, well he couldn’t stand not working so he bought a Boat Marina with a Restaurant and Bar and then owned that for almost 50 years, till he passed. I asked him about it one time, and he told me “Kid, I never expected to make it home, I was sending that stuff home because if I figured I wouldn’t be there to support my mother and sisters, at least they would have some money”.
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u/Picax8398 Sep 30 '23
Kid, I never expected to make it home, I was sending that stuff home because if I figured I wouldn’t be there to support my mother and sisters, at least they would have some money”.
🥹
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u/Cosmo48 Oct 01 '23
Honestly if the comments are right, this ring is badass. I would love to wear the ring that my grandpa took off a dead nazi
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u/rcowie Oct 01 '23
I've got a very similar ring from my grandpa except mine has ruby's in the eyes and a smaller diamond. I keep meaning to get it sized to my hand.
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Oct 01 '23
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u/Loneskumlord Oct 01 '23
You guys all finding out that you're a secret key to unlocking hidden treasure.
Now think back!
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u/Ancient-Lychee505 Oct 01 '23
This comment section reeks of "I don't have a fuckin clue, but Imma post something I know about a lion or a ring cause the whole world wants to know what I have to say"
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u/kahiau26 Sep 30 '23
This is a Victorian animal head ring. Lions, tigers, and bears were all common choices and often have open jaws with a stone inside. An antiques jeweler local to me (Poor Mouchette— google her, she’s awesome) sometimes has these and I’ve wanted one forever. She doesn’t have any in stock right now so I can’t link you. You should have it appraised for sure.
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u/Beginning_Brick7845 Oct 01 '23
What theater did he fight in? That will go a long way toward establishing provenance and whether it was an existing ring he took as a trophy or purchased, or if it was one he had made for himself. For instance the China-Burma-India Theater had a lot of jewels and precious metals and was a hotbed of smuggling, especially with American fliers.
It looks to me to be custom Made for the grandfather. Knowing the unit and theater he was in Would give a lot of clues. Then you would start backtracking from the type of diamond, composition of the gold, and design.
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u/TheShama Oct 01 '23
a day late but heres what i can help with, one way to tell if this ring is truly from WW2 is to inspect the diamond and how it is cut, anything before a certain date in the 1950’s are all hand cut stones making them much more desirable and hold more value, one way to check for this is to get a magnifying glass and look through the top the diamond, if the lines in it are perfect and all come to a perfect centered dot then it is most likely not hand cut, if it were to look wonky and the tip of the diamond has a circle with weird uneven sides coming to it, u have value my friend
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Oct 01 '23
Look for “kantinenring”. It was worn and popular by SS officers and wehrmacht . Maybe you can check it here they have similar rings there https://www.team-militaria.de/frueher-Silber-Totenkopfring-sogenannter-Kantinenring-Silber-830 And switch the german page to english
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Oct 01 '23
Wow this sub is useless.
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u/waitwheresmychalupa Oct 01 '23
If you posted this to r/scrapmetal they would be more helpful than this sub
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u/redcommi420 Sep 30 '23
Whatever you do, do not swim in a lake or ocean with it. I lost a old ring similar to this one like that years ago and I’m still pissed about it.
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u/jwumb0 Sep 30 '23
Isildur?!
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u/redcommi420 Sep 30 '23
It should have ended that day, but evil was allowed to endure. There's no strength left in the world of Men. They're scattered, divided, leaderless.
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u/SluttyUncleSam Sep 30 '23
Nazi war trophy. Probably from one of the fifty men he killed.
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Sep 30 '23
That was before he lost his shins to a machine gunner on Iwo Jima
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u/DonBongales Sep 30 '23
They was coming at me faster than I could gut’em so I had to gut’em faster!
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u/karenosmile Sep 30 '23
There were lots of rings made for officers in WWII Germany.
The prices are all over the map.
If you Google
ring löwenkopf 2. "weltkrieg"
You will see that they vary greatly.
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u/Existing_Clothes7992 Sep 30 '23
I think you can control the jungle with that on!!!! The animals will come to your beck and call
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u/SnooKiwis2161 Oct 01 '23
Ugh
Not for nothing, but if that's a nazi ring, where did the gold come from?
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u/BudgetBuilder17 Oct 01 '23
https://www.ebay.com/itm/266143393868
That may be German just like how my grand father had found some spoils as well while he was in Berlin the fall of the Nazi's in 44 or 45 when the US was helping to clean up. Can't say what they are as people will definitely get butt hurt and slanderous.
Too bad everyone wants to destroy history instead of learn and better them selves from it.
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u/hadtobethetacos Sep 30 '23
post it in r/military
probably get better help there.
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u/CoRe534 Sep 30 '23
"Got it while fighting" sounds more like he stole it from a corpse, a prisoner in a Konzentrationslager, etc
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u/hadtobethetacos Sep 30 '23
well. war trophies were, and still are a thing. Right or wrong, it does happen. another comment mentioned something about the 106th being called the golden lions. i suggested r/military because if it was an allied ring they would probably be more knowledgable about it.
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u/red1015 Oct 01 '23
few similar rings I've found clicking around google
https://romanovrussia.com/de/antique/russian-gold-diamond-lion-ring/
some places are still selling similar designs as the Lion of Judah
https://www.etsy.com/listing/246272325/lion-of-judah-ring-ruby-and-diamond-14k
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u/Antique_Damage839 Sep 30 '23
You put it on your right index finger. Point it towards the sky and say "ad victorum spolias"
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u/Fng1100 Sep 30 '23
I got a silver ww1 lions head with a large ruby in its mouth hope you find the story on it, the silver one has seen better days yours looks almost perfect.
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u/chefjryan Oct 01 '23
https://stylish-lion.com/lion-head-ring-meaning/
https://www.1001-bijoux.fr/chevaliere-lion-vermeil-et-pierre-oxyde-blanche-gros-modele-p-11378.html
OP here are a couple links that may get you started.
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u/SilentC735 Oct 01 '23 edited Oct 01 '23
Found this after a quick Google search. Same one maybe? Yours looks more worn.
www.etsy.com/listing/1358672916/antique-victorian-lion-ring-14k-gold
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u/dosipovitch Oct 01 '23
This ring looks like a die similar to ones being saved by Kevin Potter at PotterUSA. You may want to post in on their FB page or reach out to them, they are great people and he might have some knowledge of the history of the ring—such as what company made it.
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u/WokeBrokeFolk Sep 30 '23
Ehhh, best I can do is... $20
Honestly I bet this thing is worth around $15k
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u/sunnymountainsss Sep 30 '23
For some reason I think Canadian parliament would like your grandpa.
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u/nightcrewstudio Sep 30 '23
Looks like a ring, I can’t tell 100% do you have a banana for scale?
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u/Secret_Huckleberry39 Sep 30 '23
You left the part out about how he kept it up his bum for two years as a prisoner of war so the Nazis couldn’t get it back.
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u/evohans Sep 30 '23
Wow, okay found this with missing the diamond. Slightly different, silver, but leaning in the direction of your story
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u/Cynical1980 Sep 30 '23
Any hallmarks/ markings? X
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u/ico59 Sep 30 '23
None unfortunately.
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u/Cynical1980 Sep 30 '23
I'd definitely take to a dealer then to try to get it's provenance certified. It looks fantastic and priceless for its value to you but verifying the style and diamond/ gold quality and carat weight will make an enormous difference. Unfortunately no one can do that accurately from a photo. Don't allow yourself to get too excited by the links posted and if you don't like what the first dealer says you can always get a second opinion. Also do not let anyone's opinion colour your view of your grandfather, unless they were there when he acquired the ring it's pure speculation and worth nothing xxx
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u/d06r1985 Sep 30 '23
Doesn’t look like old European cut diamond , the way the diamond is faceted will give you an idea of the era ? Have it appraised ?
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u/Dfreshie Oct 01 '23
It looks like a wolf or bear in the first photo and a monkey in the second so weird
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u/Suitable-Run-5420 Oct 01 '23
It is described on Etsy as a 14k gold antique Victorian Lionhead ring
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u/Jewish-SpaceLaser420 Oct 01 '23
If my grandpa took it off the ring of a Nazi he killed? Hell yeah.
Rocking spoils of war is the ultimate fuck you
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u/Fancy_Mammoth Oct 01 '23
My great grandfather served in WW2 and brought back a number of "souvenirs" he obtained from Nazis along the way. When he passed several years ago I inherited these items and as I'm a WW2 history buff, they've become some of my most prized possessions, my own little piece of world history.
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Sep 30 '23
I’d guess French actually..looks like many Chevaliere lion vermeil et pierr pieces from that era.
Value greatly depends on weight and Karat of the gold and carat of the diamond.
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u/derkadong Oct 01 '23
I think he killed a nazi, leveled up and won this prize right off his finger.
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u/Common-Bit-4229 Oct 01 '23
when dad was fighting in hanoi,his friend hid a gold watch up his ass for 5 years
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Oct 01 '23
It concerns me how many people seem to just jump to it being Nazi related when it could be a ton of different possibilities. It's probably more likely he won it in a poker game or something benign.
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u/Responsible-Lie3624 Oct 01 '23
The ring arrears to be from the Chevaliere lion vermeil et pierr collection. This collection was created by the French jewelry company Vermeil. Vermeil is a type of gold plating that is made by applying a thick layer of gold to a base metal, such as sterling silver. Here is a link to a similar ring:
https://www.1001-bijoux.fr/chevaliere-lion-gros-modele-pierre-rouge-vermeil-p-5468.html
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u/TaviSonGod Oct 01 '23
Keep it forever. I wish that I could have something great from one of my grandparents.
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u/jackblack0828 Sep 30 '23
Imagine where he kept that uncomfortable hunk of metal …..
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u/EarlDooku Sep 30 '23
Check the item description, what does it say?
FR looks like it came straight from Dark Souls
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u/exgaysurvivordan Oct 01 '23
The comments on this are spiraling out of control, we've had to remove and ban an excessive number of people on this post, I'm locking it.