Grandfather Of Teen Killed During Burglary Says AR-15 Made Fight ‘Unfair’

[u/BallsOutKrunked]

https://slatereport.com/news/grandfather-of-teen-killed-during-burglary-says-ar-15-made-fight-unfair/

[u/Bearguchev]

Bruh… there’s a big difference between walking into a house and kicking the fucking door in or any other means of forced entry. You’re taking shit way too literally if you think people are actually just shooting at noises and not visually ID’ing someone as an intruder before defending themselves. Don’t break into an occupied dwelling, simple as. You want my stuff? Show up when I’m not home. I’m not taking my chances with a stranger who’s already proven themselves unpredictable by, ya know, breaking into my house. Go clutch pearls somewhere else…

[u/MargiManiac → u/Bearguchev]

Hey man, you obviously have it all figured out.

[u/Paladin_3 → u/MargiManiac]

I hope nobody ever kicks in your front door with brass knuckles and knives while you're home. I'm sure you'll be unarmed and probably won't even fight back out of fear for hurting one of them. And that'd be really sad for everybody who loves you. But at least you'll die thinking you're better than those of us who would have defended our lives and families.

[u/MargiManiac → u/Paladin_3]

I don't think I'm better than you. Please don't make up fiction.

[u/Bearguchev → u/MargiManiac]

You going to reply to my question? Or just avoid it and keep acting like you somehow have the moral high ground here…

[u/MargiManiac → u/Bearguchev]

I was thinking on an answer, but wanted to be sure you knew I don't view you as an adversary. Check your blood pressure, old man. (Edit: Why are you following me around to different comments? I have things going on outside of this reddit thread and haven't responded to most of the responses I've gotten.)

I genuinely don't know what I'd do in that situation, and I've been lucky enough to live in areas where I've been safe. I take precautions that it's not easy to break into my space.

But you can't honestly be suggesting that the only way to protect myself is to kill someone who is intruding on my space. Guns are tools, and if that's the tool you have close to you, why wouldn't you use it? Do you really want to shoot someone in your community who is obviously struggling with something without addressing why they're comitting whatever hypothetical crime we're talking about?

If someone doesn't want to own guns, it shouldn't be so easy to dismiss it by saying "well if they didn't want to get killed, why didn't they kill someone first?" Defending yourself, whatever, but are you truly not interested in positive change in the neighbors of your own communities?

I'd rather live in communities where we're able to build support systems that people don't have the sort of pressures that cause people to make the poor choices that put them at the end of a barrel.

I have a hard time seeing your argument outside of a hero fantasy because it doesn't solve the problem. It just gives you a tool to stop a single crime in motion, and likely end a life in the middle of it. But it's cool you're able to defend yourself, I guess.

[u/Paladin_3 → u/MargiManiac]

Okay, now I get it. The world's not fair and we don't give enough to the poor and people on drugs don't get enough help to get off drugs and the poor people of our country aren't given enough and it's just so hard to exist that it's okay to commit crimes and put other people's lives in jeopardy. And we should feel guilty if we decide to defend our lives from those kinds of people who would harm us in order to take our shit, or who are so whacked out they're just going to do who knows what for fun. Yeah, we should let those kinds of folks victimize the rest of society and never protect ourselves from them because we don't want to hurt their innocent little behinds. You're going to have to find another sub to sing Kumbaya in.

And if you want to speak seriously for a moment, we have abundant safety nets for the poor, at least here in the US. We have food stamps and free medical care if you're truly at the bottom, and there are plenty of charities that do outreach, as well as drug rehabilitation programs. You're not going to starve in this country, so nobody is stealing to be able to eat and survive.

Unfortunately, our legal system has been far too lenient on people who commit crimes, and we have some folks who decided that that's how they're going to attempt to get ahead in life. They're going to go out with weapons, and they're going to look to victimize others, hurt them, and take their stuff. The lawful citizens of this country have absolutely zero moral obligation to allow that to happen in order to prevent hurting these people who are nothing but predators.

And you're wrongly assuming that we have no compassion for these folks at the same time. I donate lots of money and do lots of outreach, and a lot of taxpayer funded rehabilitation and food programs come right out of my pocket. Plus, I have three adult children who I raised and taught them to be moral, compassionate people and not hurt others. They do the exact opposite of what this gentleman's grandson did. So that's how I'm helping to save the world that you so passionately cry over being somehow unfair to the criminal element amongst us.

I think it's hilarious that you keep making snide remarks and taking shots at us, and then when we do it in return, you get all butthurt over it.

[u/Paladin_3 → u/[deleted]]

Yeah, I'm not interested in having a conversation even though I type paragraph after paragraph about my position on this subject. I've been trying to justify every position I have with reasoning and examples, but if you want to just give me a trite response and walk away from the conversation like you won, please go right ahead. It's funny how you don't bother to try to justify the accusations you've made in this thread so far, though I'm m not sure how anybody really could.

Admit it, you think you're better than anyone who would stoop to using violence to even so much as protect their own life from a home invader. Because you think you're far above that and that it will never happen to you.

Well, I'm a retired photojournalist who's covered quite a bit of the crime beat during my career. I grew up in a very upper middle-class, safe, low crime neighborhood, where the first paper I worked at was also located. I've seen lots of people in very safe areas who had someone break into their home and suffered because they were not prepared mentally or by owning the proper tools to protect even their own life.

I wish that fate on no one, and if I can protect my family from suffering the same by being armed, I will do so.

[u/Paladin_3 → u/[deleted]]

One of the worst traits anyone can have is assuming through the myopic lens of their own experiences that that's what everybody else has experienced.. Unfortunately, I've seen multiple sides of this argument. I've seen more dead bodies than I cared to, I've seen more victims of crime as well as those who perpetrated the crime lying dead.

I've interviewed teenagers in juvenile custody for murder. As well as those who had to defend themselves from a deadly threat and how it affected them. I've worked with people out trying to stop crime, I've been on more ride alongs with cops than I care to remember.

I've also seen the damage that our prisons do and how we seem to be striving more for vengeance than any kind of rehabilitation. At the same time, I've seen the revolving door that a lot of our courts have become and the damage that comes from them turning criminals back out onto the street. I've also seen those who shirk responsibility for their own lives and how their criminal depravities become everyone else's fault in their minds. Please, don't for a second think you know me. But feel free to go ahead and judge me by the comments I've made here, just like I'm judging you by yours.

I've had guns pointed at me, but luckily, I've never had to point a gun at anyone else in anger. But I will protect my family with deadly force if I have no other choice. And I'm not going to let you or anyone else come along and tell me about the ills of society and how that makes my decision morally reprehensible. And that's pretty much you what you did with your comments in here.

[u/Paladin_3 → u/[deleted]]

You just can't help but try to make this all about politics, can you? Maybe you should come back when you actually want to debate the topic and defend the claims you've made with something more than insults. Remember, you are the one who said when three males kicks in a front door to invade an occupied home while armed with a knife and brass knuckles didn't deserve to die. Well, what do you think the appropriate response to such a situation should be? Offer them milk and cookies then sit down for a conversation about what their intensions are?

[u/Bearguchev → u/[deleted]]

This has nothing to do with what’s going on in that persons life or society as a whole. It’s a lot more simple but you’re needlessly complicating it. Don’t break into someone’s house, something that can reasonably be seen by 99.99999999% of people as a threatening act, and expect them not to defend themselves with any means possible. You’re making so many assumptions here about who I am and how I view the world just because I said I’m going to assume the worst if my home gets invaded… you’ve completely derailed the conversation and made absolutely zero real counters to anything that’s been said about the initial discussion topic: what does one do when a stranger breaks into their house? And why is somebody wrong for defending themselves from an unknown person with unknown intentions committing an incredibly serious violent felony that has a good chance of ending in harm or even death for the victim? Having more sympathy for a home invader than a victim of such crime is completely insane…

[u/Bearguchev → u/[deleted]]

The problem is, this isn’t a good conversation. Your points are a fantasy, and you refuse to acknowledge that a home invasion is a pretty serious crime only done by very dangerous people. How many people have been assaulted or murdered by a home invader? Why is the onus on the victim of the crime to exercise restraint when the invader has shown them none?

[u/Bearguchev → u/MargiManiac]

Dude, first off, I’m in my 20’s. Second off, my blood pressure? You’re the one who wrote a book. Of course we all want things to be better, but not all of us can afford to live in wealthy/safe areas where that’s easily achievable and there’s not a lot to fix in the first place. Also, I don’t care what someone is going through, if you break into my house why should I wait to see if you end my life? Your idealist fantasies are so removed from reality. If you want food? Go to a shelter… need money? Panhandle or get a sign spinning job… kicking someone’s door in is not the answer, and it’s more often than not done out of greed or violence. Truly desperate but otherwise good people are going to steal food and other goods from stores if it comes to it, why on earth would any sane person enter someone else’s home forcefully knowing damn well that person inside is going to assume the worst? Sure, you try to reason with the criminal, it’s your right, but don’t try to act like someone who shoots a home invader is in the wrong whatsoever and did not genuinely fear for their life and safety. People are unpredictable, and breaking and entering an occupied dwelling is a great way to let me know you’re unpredictable AND dangerous.

[u/MargiManiac → u/Bearguchev]

Okay!

[u/Paladin_3 → u/MargiManiac]

What else could you possibly be doing other than talking down to us when you concoct these ridiculous scenarios where we shoot our loved ones in the dark, all while trying to prove that it somehow morally wrong to protect your life with a gun from an intruder?

[u/MargiManiac → u/Paladin_3]

I'm not trying to prove any of that, you silly goose.