r/benshapiro • u/American_Streamer "Here's the reality" • Aug 26 '22

White House Lashes Out At Republicans Over Student Loan Cancellation; Conservatives Fire Back | The Daily Wire, Aug 26th, 2022 - Attempting to paint Congress Republicans as hypocrites because they took out Paycheck Protection Program (PPP) loans during the COVID pandemic, which were later forgiven. Daily Wire

https://www.dailywire.com/news/white-house-lashes-out-at-republicans-over-student-loan-cancellation-conservatives-fire-back
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u/[deleted] Aug 26 '22

That is likely more of an abuse issue not related to the underlying rationale for the program. Abuse is a valid concern but it's not relevant to the student loan handout debacle nor is it one that I find particularly interesting.

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u/Vast-Combination4046 Aug 27 '22

They are pointing out the people complaining about the cost of the program for students abusing the program for business. How do you not see a problem with millionaires complaining people living paycheck to paycheck get a bailout.

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

Well that may or may not be true. But complaints of this debt forgiveness are warranted. I have no PPP loans abs I have the same complaints of the bus ill-advised, unfair, student loan handout.

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u/Vast-Combination4046 Aug 27 '22

Kids got sold a future that didn't exist. We were told that taking out loans was an investment and when they graduated they didn't have the jobs they were training for.

I don't have a student loan and I'm not mad they are getting help with them.

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22 edited Aug 27 '22

No, they didn’t think through their decision. They aren’t victims. If you to a car dealer that sales is going to try to sell you stuff by painting a rosy picture. If you just buy what he’s selling that doesn’t mean you aren’t on the hook for your commitment because you weren’t an informed buyer. Even if you major in a good field from a quality school, there’s still no guarantee of a job. Maybe the economy is down when you finish. Maybe you’re not willing to move where the jobs are. Maybe your grades weren’t as strong as they could have been. It all comes down to responsibility and all this handout does is reinforce “You don’t need to be responsible. We will make your neighbor pay your bills.”

I never took out a dime of student loans. Yea, scholarships covered most of my undergrad degree but I never had enough to cover housing and meals so I lived at home (which I wanted to do anyway). My grad degree was partially paid by an employer and me. But now I have to pay, not just for my stepson’s college, but those on the receiving end of a Democrat handout vote-buying scheme.

But I did make some bad choices as an undergrad student and ran up credit cards debt. But I learned my lesson on that eventually and no one ever bailed me out. Today, not only do I have only a tiny bit of debt, I don’t even make late payments. The responsible in life generally wind up doing better and Biden just made it harder for these people to learn that lesson.

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

Let’s continue to make excuses for companies being shitty and predatory

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

Who is being predatory? And this involves government loans as Biden has been arrogant enough to try to cancel private loans.

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

Universities and loan companies are extremely predatory. Sallie Mae did the same thing to millennials that Fannie Mae did to Gen Xers with the housing crisis. Universities take advantage of the Pell Grant and overcharge for classes that could be taught on YouTube or on the job

And neither republicans or democrats are doing a thing to stop it because both sides are profiting

Biden canceling student loan debt is like using a piece of gum to seal a hole in a sinking boat

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

And this loan forgiveness only encourages the schools to continue to charge higher and higher fees. This moves things in the wrong direction on that issue. Ultimately this is the reasonable economic response since easily available loans with little regard for total indebtedness coupled with students who will be conditioned to expect future bailouts will increase the willingness-to-pay of the students. Knowing this, the schools will naturally raise rates to increase revenue. You can’t really expect anything else. Nothing will change until we break that willingness-to-pay and decrease it which will induce schools to lower rates.

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22 edited Aug 27 '22

Except you’re missing the part where schools have already been doing this for decades. The only thing that has changed is now there is this one time loan forgiveness. Colleges have been exploiting Pell Grants since the 80s when Reagan revamped them which caused millions more students to become dependent on loans

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

But it’s all the same problem. It’s like any bubble: the more money chasing something, the higher the price goes. It’s just different phases of the same mechanics at play. If you are responsible for setting fees, and you know that the student have access to substantial funds to pay their fees, are you going to price lower or higher?

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u/Vast-Combination4046 Aug 27 '22

"are you going to take advantage of an entire generation or just give them the service they need to join society"

10k barely touched the interest payment anyway. Kids are still paying for classes, just not getting charged quite so much for being poor.

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

You talking about this in some grand idealist manner or you face economic and practical reality. Plus they may not see it the way you do as “taking advantage” for a variety of reasons. So I ask the economic questions again: are they going to price higher or lower?

Poor? Some of the recipients of this make up to $125k. And college graduates still on average have higher salaries.

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22 edited Aug 27 '22

Right, so the current model is predatory and artificially inflates the value of college degrees. The problem has existed for decades and colleges have been allowed to exploit students because of it. Republicans are just now getting upset about it because of the student loan forgiveness. Actually I can’t even say they’re upset about the predatory practices because once again, many of them are profiting (same with Dems though)

Yes you are right it is natural for any business to raise prices when there’s more demand, but it’s also on a business to act ethically, which it is clearly evident many are not. Here’s an opportunity for both sides to step in and solve the problem and yet no one is stepping up to the plate. Look how well that worked out during the Great Recession

So are we just going to continue to allow businesses to take advantage of people? Or are we going to do something…?

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

How is it predatory? How are they “exploiting?” No one forces anyone’s hand. It’s merely economics at work. Define “artificially inflate?” You want to attack this? Get rid of subsidized and backed student loans. Let the free market govern loans like other types of loans. Break the increasing willingness of students to pay the fees. Are you willing to do that? Even if that is not entirely practical, there is little doubt there is too many and too easily obtained loans and that creates a bubble.

As to raising prices define what the ethical barrier is here in this situation. So unless you define that how is it clear the schools are not acting ethically?

You make a lot high levels claims but very few specific deductions. I have my doubt your claims are valid but that’s even hard to say without specificity.

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u/solidgold70 Aug 27 '22

Your least coherent arguement yet. Watch fox news again for some regurgitated garbage and come back tomorrow.

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u/[deleted] Aug 27 '22

It’s the old “Fox News” crutch. “I can’t deal with the substance of the argument. FOX NEWS!!!”

I don’t need Fox. In fact I was just complaining tonight that they have abandoned fair and balanced to bow to Trump. No, I am informed and synthesize the reality of events. Apparently that troubles you. Oh well.

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u/googinthegoogler Aug 27 '22

You just now decide they pander to the treasonous peach? Interesting how long that took....anyways more about responsibility please

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u/solidgold70 Aug 27 '22

Next, he will refer to himself as a "stable" genius.

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u/solidgold70 Aug 27 '22

Mortgage their future, saddle them with debt, ride them til they die. The cost of education has far outpaced inflation as the middle class gets fleeced again and again.