Ross discussing agreements with malevolent intelligences (watch the second clip) Compilation

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u/optifog Jul 15 '23

But the out in the open while a person is busy with activity abduction accounts (as opposed to the sleep interruptions, cloaking as shadow people or projecting images of themselves as Old Hags, no memory of being taken on a ship, type of abduction that goes back much longer) started in the late 1950s, as far as I've been able to tell.

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u/mamacitalk Jul 15 '23

The government was definitely doing fake abductions themselves, maybe with the tech Eisenhower got, interesting it all happens around the same time. Even MKULTRA started in 1953

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u/optifog Jul 15 '23 edited Jul 15 '23

The first outdoors, activity-interrupting abductions I'm aware of were in South Africa and Brazil, in the late 1950s, both using technology that isn't even publically acknowledged to exist today, let alone then. The beings involved included small greys, in both abduction stories, which couldn't be costumes worn by grown men. The first cattle abduction and dumping of the body I'm aware of (complete with two witnesses to the classic craft and the levitation of the cow) was 1897, before we'd invented the airplane. So I don't buy Greer's claims that Americans are doing abductions and mutilations.

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u/mamacitalk Jul 15 '23

Sounds exactly like where the cia would practice first fake abductions but I don’t believe they’re all done by humans. Brooklyn bridge abduction is a really interesting one imo

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u/optifog Jul 15 '23 edited Jul 15 '23

The Brooklyn Bridge abduction was most likely a lie, when you delve deep into the details surrounding the case and the woman. The alleged witnesses turned out not to be verifiable as real people and she impersonated somebody else on the phone to Budd Hopkins, who eventually became suspicious of her too despite being the nicest, most trusting man alive. With CIA officers like Richard Doty openly admitting that infiltrating UFO conferences, websites and research circles to spread disinformation for various purposes has long been a common practice, it's not farfetched at all that that case was an example of government interference with the man's work, knowing that he was influential.

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u/optifog Jul 15 '23 edited Jul 15 '23

It does seem likely that the CIA and Soviet attempts to create telepathy, memory blocking and memory retrieval were driven by their knowledge from experience with ETs that these were possible.

Some people attribute that interest to the number of Scientologists who've worked in or for the CIA, but there weren't Scientologists in the Soviet Union, and Scientologist CIA officers would have been among the virulently anti-drug wing, and would never have agreed to give people LSD, so it can't just have been Scientologists.

To me, the timeline suggests that L. Ron Hubbard, who was extremely well connected, learned through the grapevine that the CIA was certain these abilities were real, and wove them into his teachings, promising to help people gain them.

This would have made it easier to get CIA members who were read into the telepathy research or the telepathic ETs, interested in Scientology, and the two organisations would have influenced each other from then onwards. He founded his organisation in 1953, the same year that you point out MKULTRA started.

Do you have sources you could direct me to that have informed your thoughts on the 1950s shift in the phenomenon? It sounds like you're pulling from somewhere I haven't been yet, and I want to read as widely as possible to understand the different types of abduction and the reason for that change around Eisenhower's presidency, as a confused experiencer of the pre-Eisenhower "incubus" style levitation, paralysis and and intruder encounters that interrupt sleep, but with scoop marks, missing time and seemingly impossible bruises in the morning suggesting they're not just a parasomnia.

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u/forestofpixies Jul 15 '23

That we know of.