r/moderatepolitics • u/logic_over_emotion_ • 25d ago
Homeland Security shares new details of mysterious drone flights over New Jersey News Article
https://apnews.com/article/fbi-drones-new-jersey-a978470fa3bb07ed3e98c5b7c18f0abb27
u/NotesAndAsides 25d ago
They were first sighted November 19th and we still don't have any answers. How is that possible?
House Committee Meeting on Homeland Security Drone Threat Starts @ 35 minutes
https://www.youtube.com/live/RnDbBw1yFx4?si=i8cizrM5jMZ-D5oC
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u/logic_over_emotion_ 25d ago
There have been numerous large drone sightings the last few weeks across New Jersey, which is drawing attention and concerns from citizens and politicians across the aisle. They avoid traditional detection from radio and helicopter, and have been seen near military installations and President-elect Trump’s golf course in Bedminster.
The AP indicates that most of these are larger than hobbyist drones and likely not being flown by citizens. Governor Murphy has said the drones don’t appear to be a threat to public safety, but also that “this is something we’re taking deadly seriously”. A pentagon spokeswoman said today “our initial assessment here is that these are not drones or activities coming from a foreign entity or adversary.”
I consider myself pretty grounded but this, along with other events like the blimp that flew over the country, seem pretty unusual. Since this has already gained attention and confirmed by many people, should the government have more transparency and provide some details, if this is from our military/government? If the government isn’t aware of the source and it isn’t considered to be hobbyists, is there confidence there is no threat? Other thoughts or theories?
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u/OkBubbyBaka 24d ago
Absolutely ridiculous that it seems a foreign entity is flying spy craft right over our bases and the DoD is just “who knows who it is, whatev”. Failure after failure on their part, really makes me hope for a good shake up and clean up with whoever is in charge next. My take on it.
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u/AppleSlacks 24d ago
The pentagon spokesman stated, “our initial assessment here is that these are not drones or activities coming from a foreign entity or adversary.”
I don’t know why that makes you argue that “it seems a foreign entity is flying spy craft right over our bases.”
I don’t know how much more clear they could be that it’s the military and the tight lipped nature means it’s likely classified tech, research and testing.
The balloon from China kicked off a major response where it was shot down over the ocean and retrieved. The lack of investigative interest makes who is flying these apparent.
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u/absentlyric Economically Left Socially Right 24d ago
If they are domestic, then they need to conduct over military controlled airspace. When you start going over peoples homes and out into the wild, you should have a good PR story ready to answer questions when people start asking. Or risk people coming to their own conclusions.
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u/Kamohoaliii 24d ago
But what if that is the purpose of the test? To determine how easily and how fast they are spotted by civilian populations and what the response is.
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u/AppleSlacks 23d ago
Nope, Congress approved a corridor from Dover AFB to McGuire Joint Base just last summer.
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u/That_Shape_1094 24d ago
The pentagon spokesman stated, “our initial assessment here is that these are not drones or activities coming from a foreign entity or adversary.”
If it isn't foreign, then it must be domestic. Which is even more troubling. Why is the US government flying drones over civilian areas, while refusing to give any explanation.
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u/AppleSlacks 24d ago
Last year they approved a testing corridor for UAV’s from Dover AFB up to McGuire. The US government is actively developing all kinds of both defensive and offensive drone technologies. This is a given and is necessary due to Chinese manufacturing capabilities. We probably need to rapidly develop ways to defend against large swarms of drones.
In any event, any kind of developmental work for the military is typically at a minimum secret, perhaps classified higher, which puts it all under “need to know”.
There are laws regarding sharing that information along with penalties for doing so with parties that were not eligible to have that information. That does include US citizens.
For me personally, I am rooting for whatever they are working on to be really effective. Having watched some Ukraine war footage, drone warfare is here and now, it’s the future and it’s scary.
I don’t like the prospect of going up against the manufacturing might of China in producing fast, simple, capable drone weapons.
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u/That_Shape_1094 24d ago
In any event, any kind of developmental work for the military is typically at a minimum secret, perhaps classified higher, which puts it all under “need to know”.
Sure, we can have secrets. Just have the Pentagon come out and say that the stuff belongs to them. People are already seeing it in the sky, so pretending it isn't there, doesn't make any sense.
There are laws regarding sharing that information along with penalties for doing so with parties that were not eligible to have that information. That does include US citizens.
Details are classified. But when people are already seeing it in the sky, acknowledging the existence isn't reveling national secrets.
I don’t like the prospect of going up against the manufacturing might of China in producing fast, simple, capable drone weapons.
You should be worried about us going up against China, period. China is really good at manufacturing all sorts of things, probably more than the entire US+Europe+Japan+Korea. So long as Russia continues to provide the raw materials, the Chinese can probably out-manufacture the rest of the planet.
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u/AppleSlacks 24d ago
I mean they pretty much have. It’s not foreign, people aren’t in danger. That’s pretty much declaring they know about its origins.
Contrast that with the Chinese balloon response, where jets were scrambled, it followed and shot down over water and the materials retrieved.
If this was at all something they weren’t aware of or aware why it was there, they would have a different response.
I am in NJ though. Still yet to see one, even sat out with a fire pit this past weekend. Maybe I will catch a glimpse of one tonight.
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u/That_Shape_1094 24d ago
I mean they pretty much have
So why not come out and make a simple, clear, statement to the American people? Its not a secret anymore, so why not just do that?
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u/Bunnybuzki 23d ago
They always give us a heads up when military testing is going to be noticeable and that is indeed with other classified tech. This isn’t “clear” that it’s them especially after all the press
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u/MajorElevator4407 24d ago
It isn't a foreign entity, it is from the US government.
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u/heavyonthahound 24d ago
Why would our own government be so interested in New Jersey (of all places) that they would fly their most sophisticated drones around for all to see?
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u/Bunnybuzki 23d ago
Even though many military tests are classified, we are typically given alerts whenever there may be noise or tremors or any effect on us. The “military classified” theory really doesn’t hold up.
This feels more like a test of us, what are we willing to tolerate?
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u/McRibs2024 25d ago
No they did not.
Heck we had NJ assembly members walk out today during the briefing because the information was so useless.
There’s interviews with them walking out furious that there are no answers at all.
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u/NotesAndAsides 25d ago
Saw that. And more like this. Surely they know more than they are telling us, I hope.
Rep. Chris Smith, R-4th Dist., said at the hearing that he was told a Coast Guard boat off the Jersey Shore was followed by “between 12 and 30 of these drones as they went through the water.”
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u/Neglectful_Stranger 24d ago
Probably the military testing new stuff and then not telling the public.
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u/NotesAndAsides 24d ago
I hoped it was our military, but yesterday the pentagon said explicitly they are not military drones. Of course if it's classified they have to deny it, but that would then mean they are very bad at keeping classified operations under wraps and are causing the US public panic and speculation.
Defense contractor testing new tech? Maybe but you'd think they would be better at keeping things under wraps as well and would face frowny faces for the same reason above.
Viral marketing ploy maybe? Could be, but then why have they been allowed to fly over critical structures like military installations without the government acknowledging it and calming the speculation of the public?
The 20ft long drones that invaded airspace over Langley last year for a couple of weeks with the pentagon saying they lacked counter drone procedures.
https://thehill.com/policy/defense/4937166-drone-flights-virginia-base/
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u/1234511231351 24d ago
The Pentagon lies and it may not belong to them, it could be CIA, FBI, or NSA.
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u/Bunnybuzki 23d ago
They always give us a heads up when military testing is going to be noticeable and that is indeed with other classified tech. This isn’t “clear” that it’s them especially after all the press. And especially spying on other mimitary entities?
I wonder if someone is trying to start a war for our next president to coast on
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u/D_Ohm 24d ago
What would they be spying on in NJ is what I wanna know. The airport?
Y’know now that I think about it what ever happened to Amazon’s plans to use drones for deliveries? There’s a very large Amazon warehouse in Robbinsville.
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u/Bunnybuzki 23d ago
The coastline, it seems. I wonder if it has to do with our vulnerability to coastal flooding?
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u/klippDagga 24d ago
I just caught a load news story reporting that people are seeing the same sort of thing south of the metro area in Minnesota.
One of the people interviewed promised that she hadn’t been drinking too much wine and they showed videos they took that showed lights that moved away from the vehicle they were being recorded from.
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u/creatingKing113 With Liberty and Justice for all. 25d ago edited 25d ago
So the phrasing certainly seems compelling, but until something more substantial than eyewitness reports come out, I’m going to chalk it up to mass hysteria of people finally looking up at night and being crap at telling what something is.
Like one of the things that gets me is that people say the objects are 6’ wide. If you’re looking in the sky, you have no reference point, so how can you be sure how big something is?
Also pretty much every government agency speaks in vague terms until they have solid facts to go on, which can be good, but people take statements like “These reported objects are not foreign in nature.” to state that there’s something mysterious while it could also mean that they haven’t seen jack squat.
I’d love to be proven wrong, and will definitely be listening for any new updates, but those are my thoughts so far.
Edit: To expand on the mass hysteria point. You hear on the news that odd lights have been showing up over New Jersey. So you go outside and look around, and oh look some lights. Must be one of those drones or something. Not like New Jersey has one of the busiest airspaces in the United States.
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u/logic_over_emotion_ 25d ago
I agree with this generally, but if it’s getting comments from governors and the pentagon, aren’t we past ‘a few people seeing lights in the sky’ and mass hysteria?
This seems closer to the level of the Chinese spy balloon, that we eventually shot down, with this kind of reporting imho.
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u/creatingKing113 With Liberty and Justice for all. 25d ago edited 25d ago
I may just be way too blasé, but to me the governor just comes off as “well a lot of people are reporting things so it deserves some attention” and the Pentagon being pressured to say something when the only sure fact they have is “Well it’s not a foreign weapon.” Press releases are extremely noncommittal.
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u/logic_over_emotion_ 25d ago
I could see that too, open minded on this. I imagine people in this area are used to lots of air traffic though, and it seems to be throwing a lot of people for a loop.
Between officials saying it doesn’t seem to be hobbyists, Murphy saying it’s ‘deadly serious’ then the “Coast Guard commanding officer briefed him on an incident over the weekend in which a dozen drones followed a motorized Coast Guard lifeboat “in close pursuit” near Barnegat Light and Island Beach State Park.”
Coast Guard is now assisting FBI with investigating. Those things combined make me think there could be something to it.
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u/Bunnybuzki 23d ago
My ring app is blowing up with dozens of videos every night. And I have seen them. And people on facebook, etc. just go look, Are we enough eye witnesses for you?
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25d ago
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u/ladybug11314 24d ago
All the videos I've seen from NY are pretty clearly landing patterns for the airport. It's more noticable with it being darker earlier and it's possibly the flight pattern changed. I noticed it out by me on long Island years ago when the flight pattern for JFK changed and the planes would come in from the ocean and it looked like they were hovering because of the angle and the lights, it was a huge mind trick. I'm not saying there no funny business anywhere, but I've seen videos of pretty obvious planes and people freaking out about it.
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u/Bunnybuzki 23d ago
This seems silly we know what airplanes are. You can tell when a light is not an airplane. We have airplanes all day every day.
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u/DrunkCaptnMorgan12 I Don't Like Either Side 24d ago
Reminds me of quite a few years ago when drones were extremely popular and they were everywhere. People were flying them into people's backyards and just being annoying, this is not New Jersey either, but people started shooting them out of the sky. Drone owners would try and sue the people shooting them down, but the judges would throw it out. So, people stopped flying them in people's yard at low levels that they could be shot with shotguns. I'm not suggesting that's what people should do, especially in highly populated areas, that would be pretty dangerous, it just brought that memory back.
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u/logic_over_emotion_ 24d ago
True, it does seem like I hear about them less these days from their initial popularity.
There seems to be many reports of large drones too, doesn’t seem to fit the average citizen drones from recent years? Not confident here though.
Purely speculative, but I find it interesting China has made recent news for their significant drone demonstrations, and they were also the owners of the balloon that crossed the US too.
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u/DrunkCaptnMorgan12 I Don't Like Either Side 24d ago
I know absolutely nothing of drone technology, not even going to lie. It just seems if the authorities or even the citizens were that worried about it, they have to land somewhere at sometime. Follow them to the source? Maybe even with another drone?
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u/Bunnybuzki 23d ago
I’m really tempted to buy a drone to spy on the other drones, but also scared that they would all follow me home
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u/TheDan225 Maximum Malarkey 24d ago
So given the current (or arguably, the current Lack of a functioning president and VP of the US) almost complete lack of specific information - we can assume its pretty much any opposing nation that would want to spy on US military facilities.
Since this administration already has a history of allowing China to spy on the US with their weather balloon (a few years ago), until it got problematic media attention, I put my money on China, doing this, again. Second in line would be Iran.
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u/logic_over_emotion_ 24d ago
I don’t want to speculate too much without evidence, but did find it interesting that China has made the news for its drone capabilities and synchronization demonstrations lately.
One recent article that covers it a bit. https://www.the-independent.com/asia/china/swarm-carrier-drone-china-airshow-zhuhai-b2648935.html
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u/autosear 24d ago edited 24d ago
I don't think these "drones" exist. They're airplanes and people have been whipped into a frenzy, thinking everything is some Iranian drone spying on their stuff.
Reminds me of the 2016 "clown" sightings.
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u/logic_over_emotion_ 24d ago
Thoughts on the article excerpt (below) from the coast guard, with commanders saying a bunch were following their boats?
“Smith said a Coast Guard commanding officer briefed him on an incident over the weekend in which a dozen drones followed a motorized Coast Guard lifeboat “in close pursuit” near Barnegat Light and Island Beach State Park in Ocean County.
Coast Guard Lt. Luke Pinneo told The Associated Press Wednesday “that multiple low-altitude aircraft were observed in vicinity of one of our vessels near Island Beach State Park.”
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u/autosear 24d ago
It's certainly possible; I'm just skeptical currently because people tend to see the things they're looking for. At least that's how things seem to go down usually.
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u/logic_over_emotion_ 24d ago
Fair enough, I gave some more credibility when I saw the military personnel and pentagon chipping in, but I could see it turning out either way! Or us never knowing, which is always the worst haha.
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u/1234511231351 24d ago
We live in an age of hyper-skepticism where everything it shot down as "nothing unordinary". This is definitely something to pay attention to.
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u/autosear 24d ago
Interesting, my perception is the opposite. I feel like almost everything is overblown these days and reality is much more mundane. I guess it is just a matter of perspective.
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u/Bunnybuzki 23d ago edited 22d ago
It sounds like you are saying that you believe the simplest explanation is that you are smarter than everyone. We have airplane traffic all day, everyday. It is actually very insulting to think we are just now suddenly getting confused. Not only that but by now there must be thousands of videos you can look at yourself showing they are definitely not airplanes. I get a dozen on my ring app every night. We have ruled out starlink too. We even have simple apps that tell you what those lights in the sky are, and if they are satellites and planes and not very obviously a much closer and unregistered source it will tell you.
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u/klew33 25d ago
ACHR and JOBY. Buy and you will thank me later. This is the future of marketing.
If it is aliens then start keeping full cups of water in your bedroom.
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u/Sabertooth767 Neoclassical Liberal 25d ago
>So who or what is behind the flying objects? Where are they coming from? What are they doing? “My understanding is they have no clue,” Peterson said.
So they don't have the details we all want.