r/britishcolumbia • u/ubcstaffer123 • 19h ago
Immigration fraud in Canada is 'extremely high,' a former B.C. premier says Photo/Video
https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/video/9.660150743
u/AloneChapter 17h ago
And these same politicians allowed it to happen. Along with money laundering and selling our assets to their friends
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u/Negligent__discharge 14h ago
Vote for us and we will keep these options open. If we fixed things, what would we run on?
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u/Sevencross 19h ago
It’s everywhere, even prince george. The homeless population continues to grow and places like Walmart and McDonald’s are fully staffed with foreign workers
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u/neometrix77 19h ago edited 17h ago
Walmart or McDonalds wages not being enough to afford a place to stay is a bigger problem.
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u/gunawa 17h ago
There the same problem, locals applying drop 'cause it ain't sh1t, companies cry 'labour shortage' and get TFWs for less than min that are pretty much locked in on that permit. Ain't the immigrants fault, it's the greedy ass companies that won't raise wages, and the consecutive liberal and conservative fed govs that keep answering to their corporate sponsors instead of their constituents
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u/redditneedswork 14h ago
What should happen is that we let market economics do its job and those employers go "Shit, we cannot find needed workers if we're offering poverty wages!" and raise their fucking wages.
This is how market economics are SUPPOSED to work. But what does the government do? They bend all the rules to make sure that they NEVER work in the worker's favour!
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u/dergbold4076 12h ago
I always felt that how the market should work is a lie. To corps it's working as intended.
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u/Spartan05089234 6h ago
The market says that Wal mart went and found a cheaper source of labour and that's a good business decision. It's for government to regulate (and police) what labour Wal mart is allowed to access.
If everyone stopped shopping steal mart u til they hired locals, that would also be the market at work.
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u/hiyou102 13h ago edited 12h ago
I don’t want to have pay increased prices to subsidize lazy and incompetent Canadians
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u/RentedTuxedo 12h ago
Can you explain what you mean by that?
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u/hiyou102 12h ago edited 11h ago
If some people are not able to the job at a price, ability, or work ethic that employers value I don’t see why it should be my job to ensure they are hired. Ultimately this increases prices for customers and productive people.
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u/Particular_Chip7108 19h ago
Well you can if you are willing to hotbed your air mattress flooring.
After 10 years one of the bunch rises above the rest and becomes a mechanic, or restaurant owner etc... they will own their house and rent a room to a couple of friends in the basement while the rest are gone back to their country.
Where im from I see Philipinos that were able to work up the ladder and turn out doing alright. I tip my hat to them.
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u/redditneedswork 14h ago
Filipinos seem to integrate a lot better...that said, they also seem to form a bit of a pack mentality when there are a bunch of them in any one workplace.
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u/hiyou102 17h ago
Should BC have a higher minimum wage?
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u/redditneedswork 14h ago
YES.
Current system: Minimum wage is not enough to live on...so what happens? The government uses YOUR TAX DOLLARS to top it up through various social programs. They are, in effect, subsidizing the profits of shitty employers that pay poverty wages using YOUR money.
Set minimum wage high enough to live on and we don't need a bunch of inefficient, expensive-to-administer social programs.
Look at the minimum wage in Seattle. Hasn't caused their economy to collapse yet!
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u/hiyou102 13h ago
Fair enough. I find it funny how many people complain about wages and don’t realize that the govt sets them. Ultimately the minimum wage is a subsidy from more to less productivity members of society.
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u/redditneedswork 12h ago
In theory it is. It has a host of benefits as well. Higher minimum wage = more incentive to increase productivity per worker = higher productivity, brought about by market forces. I don't think it's a coincidence that our government allows endless importation of slave labour (which depresses wages) from the third world and our productivity has cratered, while those countries that don't fuck their populace in a similar manner have increasing productivity.
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u/hiyou102 12h ago
Ultimately this totally disregards the the incentive of the individual. Why would anyone do anything skilled if they can make $40 an hour without putting any effort into improving their skills. The most productive places are ones like Singapore (which has no minimum wage and lots of TFW) where there is competitive pressure stay on top and have the best skills. Already as someone who actually put in the effort it doesn’t seem ideal to have my entire paycheque go to lazy people who never bothered to learn any real skills.
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u/redditneedswork 10h ago
If unskilled work paid 40 an hour, skilled would pay a lot more.
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u/hiyou102 10h ago
Why would it? We’re not producing more skilled jobs in the process and lose any remaining export competitiveness. All we’re doing is making life more expensive for people who actually put effort in and learned useful skills.
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u/redditneedswork 10h ago
Because of scarcity. Supply and demand would still be a thing.
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u/RandomAccountYVR 10h ago
As one of those people who want to the effort of leaning useful things, this one is called price sensitivity. :)
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u/Batmans_burger_shack 15h ago
Increasing minimum wage does nothing to help affordability. Lived in Sydney Australia about 10years ago. Minimum wage was $18.50 at the time Talked to locals, many seemed to think the increased minimum caused housing and consumable goods (food, toiletries) to go up enough that the minimum wage individuals were still in the same place after few years. It brought the middle class down because their costs went up but didn't't get the boost to their pay. I feel any form of increase to income for an entire economic class just gets preyed upon by the housing and food market.
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u/SeaMoan85 16h ago
Many of those who are homeless on the street have mental issues and drug addictions, which prevents them from joining the workforce. Those issues need to be addressed first so they can become productive members of society.
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u/jenh6 16h ago
And some can never be productive members of society, they need a lot of support.
There’s also a big stigma, so ones who do want to work could be held back from being unable to get a job without a permanent address and a car.17
u/SeaMoan85 16h ago
You're right. Some, dare I say, need to be institutionalized.... It sucks because these people didn't ask for this or plan for it. Unfortunately, their rights to freedom infringe on the rights of the majority of Canadians who are impacted by their personal issues.
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u/ThisAintI 12h ago
Have you ever had a foreigner* look at you in a way that made you feel unwelcome in your own home?
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u/SeaMoan85 12h ago
I'm referring to the fact that foreigners make up almost none of our street homeless.
No, i can't say I have. Most foreigners I have encountered are very respectful. I have, however, had my fellow Canadians make me feel uncomfortable in my own home....
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u/SeaMoan85 8h ago
You're absolutely right the stigma is real. Unfortunately, even if most of these people had housing (which they should, we shouldn't have anyone on the streets) they would still not be able to get a job because their drug addiction is the only important thing. They can't hold a job, and prospective employers will see this.
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u/butters1337 10h ago
Being on the street also contributes to an “institutionalised” mentality. Not all of those mentally affected or drug addicted homeless people were that way when they became homeless.
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u/SeaMoan85 8h ago
Stop being ridiculous.
You're telling me that most of the people living on the street who I encounter when I walk my downtown are just people who can not find work? These people are not looking for work. They are either surrounded by garbage sleeping, wandering around high, or looking for ways to get high. The streets don't make them this way, they are on the streets because they are too fucked up too live with other responsible adults. The streets might make it worse but don't kid yourself they are on the streets because they have burnt all their bridges and lifelines with their mental illness/drug abuse
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u/SeaMoan85 10h ago
I dunno about that.... I don't typically see normal people on the street.... just saying
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u/BeenBadFeelingGood 9h ago
normal people?
do you see people in pain at the hospital taking drugs? or how about rich people in pain taking drugs? is it any different for poor people in pain? why?
people use drugs to deal with pain. poverty and homelessness is painful af. the drugs alleviate the pain… that is what normal people do. normal people try and stop the pain
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u/SeaMoan85 8h ago
Normal people can be functioning drug addicts. What isn't normal is ones drug habit affecting their ability to provide for themselves.
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u/BeenBadFeelingGood 3h ago
so poor addicts are not normal, but rich addicts are normal?
i wish you never fall into either position. addiction is a mental health disease and it is painful either way
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u/rainman_104 14h ago
Yes however there is also the families staying in an RV at a rest stop who have fallen on hard times.
It's not just the visible poor. Our government is disgusting honestly. TFW are indentured servitude. When your presence in Canada is dependent on your work performance you can bet your ass it'll be better than my 15 year old who can't put down his phone for more than a few minutes.
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u/SeaMoan85 14h ago
I agree. My use of the word "most" in my comment indicated I realize that not everyone who is homeless on the street has mental or drug issues. I just believe that those with those issues make up the majority.
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u/hiyou102 13h ago
So as a consumer I should gladly accept higher prices and worse work because they happen to be the right race? Fuck that.
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u/SeaMoan85 8h ago
What the fuck are you talking about?? Why higher prices? Why worse work? What's the right face? I don't understand..
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u/hiyou102 8h ago
Quit trying to make my shit more expensive
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u/SeaMoan85 7h ago
Who is making your shit more expensive? How are they? I still don't know what you're talking about?
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u/fluxustemporis 12h ago
A huge number of homeless are also people who've aged out of foster homes
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u/Ok_Basket_5831 15h ago
These jobs are great for them. When they are able to rebuild their lives, where will the work? Straight into engineering?
These jobs were great for 4 groups. Teenagers, people getting back on their feet and to work up in their lives, people not born into privilege, family, or connection, immigrants
We only see immigrants now. And not the kind providing anything Canada needs.
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u/RandomAccountYVR 15h ago
Aa engineering grad of three years ago laid off twice of no fault of my own, month 6 of unemployment loams. Its fucked all over tbh.
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u/SeaMoan85 8h ago
What field of engineering are you in? I find this to be surprising. I'm in trades, and engineers are not in surplus.
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u/SeaMoan85 8h ago
Look, there is nothing wrong with immigrants, I'm willing to bet your family immigrated here at some point. Immigrants become Canadians, we are a country of immigrants.
I believe what you are referring to is temporary foreign workers, or foreign students. Neither of those are immigrants as they are not planning on becoming citizens.
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u/hiyou102 13h ago
I need to food and groceries thank you very much. Ideally at an affordable price. I am tied of subsidizing lazy and incompetent people.
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u/Motor_Expression_281 5h ago
Well surely after importing what seems like half of the developing world we are generating more tax income that can be spent on necessary social programs for the needy… right? Or not.
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u/SatanicPanic__ 13h ago
these are the people the welfare state needs to take care of, not random people from around the world.
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u/SeaMoan85 13h ago
Of course. Random people from around the world are not the homeless on our streets, Canadians are.
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u/hiyou102 13h ago edited 11h ago
The immigrants are the ones subsidizing the those on welfare who mostly spend the money on drugs and alcohol.
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u/Equivalent-Cod-6316 6h ago
Low wage TFW schemes subsidize Burger King franchise owners at the expense of the social system, unfortunately.
Obviously a significant fraction of the skilled working population is also comprised of immigrants to Canada who do much more than pull their weight, but I'm not sure people are lumping these groups together in this conversation.
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u/ConfusionInTheRanks 3h ago
Actually, they're subsidizing the businesses. They pay these workers less, give them worse working conditions, and it suppresses local wages.
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u/Ebiseanimono 14h ago
Could you clarify the correlation between the homeless in your area and non-citizen workers in low paying jobs?
Just want to see the connection relating to your hypothesis and the data you have to share about it.
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u/hiyou102 17h ago
Many homeless are unable to show up on time, work regular shifts, or do their jobs properly. Often have drug addictions or mental issues. In reality you’re mostly just going to get higher prices, less open hours, and store closures if you get rid of workers.
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u/P-2923 16h ago
I guarantee you some of those people are homeless because of this mess, I myself am worried about this soon. My job is up in a few months here and I have no idea what comes next. I have always worked low skilled jobs for the last 30 something years and managed. Looking around I do not think I will be hired at anywhere I have experience in simply because I am not from our chosen country of newcomers.
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13h ago edited 11h ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/P-2923 11h ago
Bailing me out by me just wanting a job in my own country!? I never asked for a bailout friend, just a right to another job! If you have looked around, you would see that once an establishment becomes staffed by newcomers exclusively, they do not hire outside of their own! Get real pal!
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u/dingdingdong24 19h ago
Honestly the locals don't bother working.
Rather go on welfare or EI or claim disability.
Go look at the ethnicities of the people in the welfare line every month
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u/Sloogs 18h ago edited 18h ago
My nephews are having trouble finding entry level work right now. It's rough. Sure once they're done high school they can work at a mining camp I guess but not really an option when you're in high school still. Also one of them would definitely not be well suited for that kind of work compared to service work, which just doesn't exist nor doesn't pay well anymore thanks to TFW abuse.
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u/hiyou102 11h ago edited 10h ago
So the issue is that people who don’t even have a high school diploma can’t find a job? Really? No one is entitled to a job.
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u/RandomAccountYVR 9h ago
You mean high schoolers can't enter the workforce? That isn't an issue, that young people who may want to begin saving for an education or other important milestones in life shouldn't be afforded that opportunity? I think we need to stop letting people lie there way into Canada such that those opportunities don't exist. Jesus Christ, nobody is saying they're entilted to a job but the opposite. The people being brought over, who are LYING ON THEIR APPLICATIONS and cheating the systems (individuals and companies) aren't and shouldn't be entilted to fuck all.
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u/Patient_Response_987 18h ago
that is complete bs ..... go out there drop 1000 resumes no one responds .... go look at the toronto jobs subs and youll see ..... there are people with masters applying at walmart and the like ..... its biased and unfair system where everyone says canadians are lazy and wont work so they have no choice but to hire tfw's then why are all these people saying they are putting out resumes and not getting responses so dont give me that shit
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u/Plane_Example9817 18h ago
This is just not true. You realize that our government doesn't just hand out welfare to its citizens like it's nothing. You have literally no idea how the system works and are spouting a bunch of bs.
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u/hiyou102 17h ago
The entire DTES lives off welfare. There is a spike on overdoses every time they get a payment.
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u/Particular_Chip7108 19h ago
A lot of people gave up. They got on the drugs don't see a future. Since pot is legal, other drugs have become a bannality.
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u/Complete_Tourist_323 19h ago
It's the corporations who own the politicians and don't want to compete for labor anymore and want access to cheap labor and surpress wages for all Canadians and pocket the difference
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u/Ghoulius-Caesar 12h ago
Ding ding ding.
Canadians are getting sold out by corporations. They want workers that will accept low wages and who aren’t accustomed to labour rights.
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u/Particular_Chip7108 19h ago
I tried to explain this to somebody yesterday. Got called a racist.
But its just human nature. If you make a system with no checks and balances, people will abuse.
Then I mentionned the 80-20 natural distribution and they freaked out assuming that high of immigrants cheat the system. Well its no different that the people that 4010 grapes at the self checkout or baxk into a car in a parking lot. They are people like u and me if there is a system to be cheated a significant percentage will do it. They are not magical beings that shit rainbows. Just humans that breathe and bleed like me and you.
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u/604wrongfullybanned 17h ago
Sorry what is "4010 grapes?"
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u/Particular_Chip7108 17h ago
Banana code. Bananas are cheap.
***Its 4011 lol not a good thief here 🤦♂️
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u/figurative-trash 15h ago
Everything is 4011 to me at the self checkout: bananas, milk, eggs, protein powder, books, flat screen TVs, -- all are $1.50 per kilogram.
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u/solutionischocolate 15h ago
Do you really buy things by the KG that aren’t meant to be bought by weight, like books,eggs, and flat screen TVs?
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u/fanglazy 18h ago
Hawks and doves game theory. All doves — people who live as a cooperating community - thrives for ages. Add one hawk to the equation and the community eventually crumbles.
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u/sonotimpressed 18h ago
Duh, drive down Scott road and every other store is an immigration consultant/lawyer or Indian restaurant.
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u/FavoriteIce 17h ago
These places are collapsing now with the new student visa rules. Good riddance I say.
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u/KlausSlade 19h ago
People have been saying this for years. Unfortunately the government called those people out.
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u/seeyousoon2 18h ago
Really I couldn't tell by looking at 19 out of every 20 cars that drive by my house.
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19h ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Hipsthrough100 19h ago
It’s not the immigrants it’s the rich who want to operate without borders, for themselves. They lobby the government and then use every loophole they can while obfuscating their intentions.
It’s even worse that BC has a huge wage theft issue as well and it’s TFW that are exploited there as well.
I think that’s the only nuance where racism comes in. If someone wants to blame Indian immigrants as the problem then they are fkin racist to the core. We have issued over 1 million Ukrainian war visas alone and are approving more for Israel but not Palestine. If people aren’t willing to understand the issue but only point at brown immigrants, then yea it’s racist.
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u/Few-Drama1427 18h ago
What are the govt agencies doing then when frauds try to cheat the system enmass? Like a student with literal fake admission letter shows up at the airport, whose job is it to screen that person?
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u/Particular_Chip7108 19h ago
Such a big country with nowhere to build. "Can't do this can't do that"
If there was a way to spread out the population more... I think the country would be much peaceful.
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u/witcherd 18h ago
We need a fair review of the LMIA and LMO process, which is abused by corporations to import cheap labour; And a fair review of the student visa and academic access to residency, to calibrate for areas Canada needs expertise on to be able to compete in the global economy.
This is not to say immigration is bad or should cease to happen; Calibration of existing systems and processes is healthy and should be done routinely to prevent abuse and ensure original goals are met (or expanded).
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u/dingdingdong24 19h ago
Ujjal.dosanjh is an uncle Tom.
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u/ecclectic Lower mainland via Kootenays 18h ago
He's a fully integrated Canadian. He doesn't have allegiance to India and doesn't put his religion over his politics, that doesn't make him an uncle Tom.
There are a lot of reasons to dislike him, but this isn't a valid one.
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