A question I had about the "what is a women " documentary

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u/toastyhoodie Conservative Jan 31 '23

His wife does at the end.

“An adult, human female”

It’s a great documentary honestly.

17

u/Irish_Punisher Jan 31 '23

Can't get much simpler than that.

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

So what’s the point

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u/Irish_Punisher Jan 31 '23

If you cannot simply and coherently define your terms and definitions, then the logically conclusion is you're arguement is fallible. So one either knows it and is lying to get their way, or one is arrogant, willfully or not, but refuses to acknowledge their fallacy. Either is a net negative for one's idea.

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

So you’re basically INSISTING that a very small perhaps confused populace has to justify their feelings based on logical reasoning? Do you apply this to everyone equally or are the trans folk somehow stuck in your craw? I personally think the whole thing is rather odd, but as a member of the LGBTQ community I support their right to live their best lives. I don’t see where it even remotely impacts other people.

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u/Irish_Punisher Jan 31 '23

I apply that to any idea one has. Be it religion, freedom, guns, work, etc. I am simply saying if we cannot agree on mere definitions of words pertaining to these ideas, we can't find common ground to move forward harmoniously. I'm a Libertarian bud, you can live your best life. But when certain ideas are put forth that can vilify or punish me or my family's lifestyle, simply because we don't shut up and accept the all the terms of the LGBTQ people, that's when tempers flair. We have to find common ground, but yall gotta meet us halfway on the logic side. Doing what "feels" right isn't always what is "objectively " right.

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

I’m not sure how you or your family’s lifestyle is impacted. There are any number of things that other people do/believe/participate in that are contrary to my personal beliefs, but I don’t find a reason to publicly humiliate and denigrate them. We live in a pluralistic society, what do trans people want from your family that you can’t agree with?

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u/Irish_Punisher Jan 31 '23

Passing the same law in Canada that would criminalize mis-gendering someone. Permitting teachers in school to "educate" my daughter under 13 years old, about gay/lesbian/trans sex, without parental consent. Enabling underage transitioning, up to and including use of hormone blockers, also without parental knowledge or consent. Those are perhaps the main 3 I have when it comes to the current LGBTQ agenda that make it very difficult to sympathize with their ideas.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Isn't that kind of circular though ? You can't use the word in the definition. Isn't this just basically saying a woman is a woman?

26

u/toastyhoodie Conservative Jan 31 '23

There’s no use of the word woman in that definition.

The people in the documentary saying a woman is “someone who defines as a woman”, is circular.

Oxford Dictionary defines woman as “an adult female human being”

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Yea, their definition is definitely circular and meaningless. But imo saying a woman is a female is just as meaningless, if you disagree could you tell me what new information is being conveyed by Oxfords definition.

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u/Pigmarine9000 Facts don’t care about your feelings Jan 31 '23

saying a woman is a female is just as meaningless

how?

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Because to the best of my knowledge woman and female mean basically the same thing ( of I'm wrong please correct me in that) so the definition is basically a woman is a woman which convoys no new information and therefore has no utility.

13

u/Pigmarine9000 Facts don’t care about your feelings Jan 31 '23

So what is your definition of a woman?

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Well I'm not entirely sure tbh. I think it's more that there are many female characteristics and woman will have more of them then men but I haven't found a singular definition that includes all woman and excludes all men.

Tbh my view in it is kind of like colour. There is an underlying fact of the matter about colour ( the wave length which in this example is analogous to the biological differences between men an woman). But the destination of where one colour begins and another ends is completely man made. We had to draw a line somewhere so we did, doesn't mean that line is wrong just means the edge cases are very blurry .

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u/Pigmarine9000 Facts don’t care about your feelings Jan 31 '23

Men don't have vaginas so I'd say that definitely does exclude all men. Female characteristics make women, women.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

What about those who have a vagina and a penis. Or xx individuals who are not respective to testosterone and don't develop any male characteristics in the womb?

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u/stickhorse Jan 31 '23

All women are females, but not all females are women. A woman is a female of the adult variety. Like a girl is an adolescent female.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

What's a female then.

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u/stickhorse Jan 31 '23

Female: of or denoting the sex that can bear offspring or produce eggs, distinguished biologically by the production of gametes (ova) that can be fertilized by male gametes.

1

u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Then I say what about those who can't produce eggs. And you say that that's a small minority and doesn't count. I say if you have a binary system and an individual isn't in either categories it's not binary. What next?

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u/toastyhoodie Conservative Jan 31 '23

If you look at female in Oxford, it’s defined as the biological definition “belonging to the sex that can lay eggs or give birth to babies”

Since we know the females of the species only have uterus’s and fallopian tubes, this shouldn’t ever have even been a discussion.

You can change yourself to look, or appear as a man, but biology states you aren’t. Just like you can appear to be a woman externally.

And I won’t participate in the delusion.

Blaire White completely looks like a woman, full stop. There is zero chance, ever, ever that Blaire will bear children.

0

u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

belonging to the sex that can lay eggs or give birth to babies

Does this mean an an individual, even with xx chromosomes that is barren is not a woman?

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u/toastyhoodie Conservative Jan 31 '23

Barren or not, their body contains (or once contained) a uterus, and ovaries.

XX equals female

XY equals male

There is no amount of hormones that will change the molecular structure of a person to become something they are not.

1

u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

There is no amount of hormones that will change the molecular structure of a person to become something they are not.

Never said it would. I'm not an idiot and I'm not advocating for a position. I'm honestly just trying to understand the rights perspective.

Barren or not, their body contains (or once contained) a uterus, and ovaries

Would this mean that if you could surgically implanted a uterus into a man then even if he doesn't have the capacity to give birth he would be a woman? Or that a woman born without a uterus ( like with Mayer-Rokitansky-Küster-Hauser Syndrome) that she is not a woman?

Also I wonder what you think about people who don't have xx or xy chromosomes.

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u/toastyhoodie Conservative Jan 31 '23

You can’t surgically implant a uterus into a man.

He still would have XY chromosomes. Making him a male of the species.

Even a woman born without a uterus would have XX chromosomes. Making her a female of the species.

And intersex people fall in a minute percentage of people. 0.018% Per PubMed.

The thing is, this concept has only become a problem as we have lived with the internet age and mentally ill people have become increasingly prevalent.

Think about it, 15 years ago this wasn’t an issue in society. And now it is?

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

You can’t surgically implant a uterus into a man.

Probably not. But I see no reason why this couldn't be an option in 20 years ( I'm speaking scientifically not ethically).

He still would have XY chromosomes. Making him a male of the species.

Even a woman born without a uterus would have XX chromosomes. Making her a female of the species.

So a woman is defined by her chromosomes? Because before you said the definition was whether she had a uterus or not. Could you explain which one it it.

And intersex people fall in a minute percentage of people. 0.018% Per PubMed.

Oh definitely, they are a tiny minority. But if they don't fit into the definition then the definition doesn't incompass all humans, no? It's an incomplete definition that applies to the majority but not to everyone.

Also there are animals who are born with both male and female chromosomes. I know the conversation is about humans but I find it interesting non the less.

The thing is, this concept has only become a problem as we have lived with the internet age and mentally ill people have become increasingly prevalent

That's your opinion my guy. Third gender has existed in ancient societies and while they are a far cry from modern trans people I think it's interesting that even thousands of years ago there were humans questioning the gender binary.

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u/stickhorse Jan 31 '23

Also I wonder what you think about people who don't have xx or xy chromosomes.

Everybody has XX or XY chromosomes. Some people have an extra of one or the other. That doesn't make them a 3rd gender, it just means they're a little of both. Nobody has XZ chromosomes.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

You just said that 11=112. Do you realise how silly what you said is? I'll our DNA is made up of 4 components, does that made all genes the same ? Silly goose.

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u/rationallyobvious Jan 31 '23

🙄

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

It's an honest question.

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u/rationallyobvious Jan 31 '23

That's the point of the piece. The answer is simple. The reason it's hard for others is because they are avoiding the answer. It's literally mental gymnastics on display.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Yea I got that. But I'm still confused as to what is the definition Matt proposes. Only answer I got here is adult human female which as far as I can tell is a circular definition.

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u/rationallyobvious Jan 31 '23

How would you define a woman?

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Well I'm not entirely sure, that's why I came to the sub of the self reported expert to ask.

My feeling though is it's a social category heavily rooted in biology. It has many characteristics but no one defining feature. Kind of like how the colour red is a social construct but the wave lengths is a fact of physics.

How do you define a woman?

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u/rationallyobvious Jan 31 '23

The adult female of the human species.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Sure. What is the definition of female though.

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u/Hawkidad Jan 31 '23

Why is it so important for you to not accept a basic fact of life. Have you questioned why this basic fact has all of a sudden been challenged at this moment. Who seems to be promoting this? Why would they be promoting something so contrary to humanity? Does this unite or sow confusion and division? Who is gaining by this division ,this chaos?

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Probably the Jews.

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u/injury Jan 31 '23

Reading your replies, no it isn't

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u/Darklighter_01 Jan 31 '23

It isn't a circular definition because they don't mean the same thing. Yes, all human females are women, and all women are female, but just because they refer to the same being doesn't make the definition circular. If you change any part of that definition (Adult, Human, Female), you are no longer referring to a woman.

Young human female: Girl

Adult (other animal) female: usually has it's own name (cow, lioness, hen, etc)

Adult human male: Man

Mammals are dimorphus, and we call the two categories of mammals within the species Male and Female. Definitions for male and female already exist. I guess we could debate over what the definition of female is, but I think that one is already pretty nailed down. Adult human frmale only refers to one kind of creature, and that's a woman

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u/foothillsman11x Feb 01 '23

Nothing circular about the definition of a woman being "an adult human female".

If you want to see circular definitions, watch the comments from the people who try to avoid answering that simple question in the documentary.....

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u/Blueit613 Feb 01 '23

Oh yea the whole a woman is someone who identifies as one is silly and circular, no disagreement there.

But saying a woman is a female is also circular because to the best if my knowledge in this context woman and female are ostensibly interchangeable.

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u/foothillsman11x Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 01 '23

No. Because female is a biological term to describe the female sex of a species.

So all adult human females are women, but fully developed females of any other species are not women.

Woman: an adult human female.

You are welcome for the correction 👍

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u/Blueit613 Feb 01 '23

female is a biological term to describe the female

So female means female. Thanks for clearing that up.

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u/foothillsman11x Feb 01 '23

Woman: an adult human female

You are really circling the drain

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u/Blueit613 Feb 01 '23

Yea, a woman is a female. And a female is a female. I'm completely caught up with your logic my guy.

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u/foothillsman11x Feb 01 '23

A woman is an adult human female.

Female is defined by the sex that can produce eggs or offspring, that can be fertilized by male sperm.

So all women are females, but not all females are women.

An adult female deer is not a woman. Get it?

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u/Blueit613 Feb 01 '23

Oh I'm sorry, this is quite silly of me not to understand. So a barren woman is a man, right? Just want to make sure I follow your logic correctly this time.

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u/foothillsman11x Feb 01 '23

fe·male /ˈfēˌmāl/:

Denoting the sex that can bear offspring or produce eggs, distinguished biologically by the production of gametes (ova) that can be fertilized by male gametes.

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u/Stunner4657 Jan 31 '23

Maybe if you watched it, you'd know his definition.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

I don't especially want to thought. That's why I asked here.

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u/Stunner4657 Jan 31 '23

It is funny you ask for information but don't want facts, so it is troll operation?

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Read my comments dude,I've answered nearly every person who commented with a good faith response. Of you think I'm a troll that's on you. And anyway, I'm just "asking questions" no?

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u/DarthBalls5041 Leftist Tear Drinker Feb 01 '23

His wife answers it at the end of the movie and she says that a woman is a human adult female

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u/Blueit613 Feb 01 '23

Gee thanks

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u/DarthBalls5041 Leftist Tear Drinker Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 01 '23

Wtf dude? You were questioned whether you were trolling and you said that all you wanted was a simple answer. Then I literally told you the what he says the definition is in the documentary and youre reaction indicates differently.

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u/Stunner4657 Jan 31 '23

I wasn't being mean Blueut613, what is a woman is funny if you like that stuff

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

I'm not a big fan of Matt Walsh tbh so don't think I will. But thanks for the recommendation non the less.

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

He’s on the Right Wing nut radio network every day. All trans all the time

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

Yea it's to keep people occupied with the culture war so they don't ask any hard questions. Just sad.

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u/cliffotn Jan 31 '23

This “question” felt disingenuous, reading OP’s comments made it clear, OP has a stance and is trying to spark up a debate. And is debating.

The answer is a woman is an adult biological female - two X chromosomes. That OP tries to bend their mind into a pretzel, leaning on pedantic notions, trying to call it circular reasoning is telling.

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u/Hawkidad Jan 31 '23

Life is confusing enough and it’s tremendously sad that academics along with deep state actors have pushed this upon the youth. My heart breaks for them, puberty is tough enough and now through this unnecessary mass hysteria the youth have to navigate. It will pass but the cost will be high.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

You seem pretty ideologically locked on this so I won't waste my time convincing you otherwise.

I'll just say that every single time society has made a change in the progressive direction ( woman's rights ,civil rights, gay rights) there are people claiming that it will destroy the status quo and erode society. At the end of the day it won't be me or you who decide who is right or will be history .

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u/[deleted] Jan 31 '23

Do you genuinely feel our culture and country is better off than 30-40 years ago? How old are you?

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

It’s definitely different. The mass movement away from living amongst family has taken a serious bite at family ties and kinship. A lot of fringe stuff has been kicked up by the Internet.

The entire “mean asshole” /MAGA thing has done permanent damage. You don’t like modern society, so let’s just destroy everything isn’t really a positive approach.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

I'm not American so my opinion probably doesn't really count much but from what I know of America, it's such a huge and diverse country that it would be virtually impossible to give a binary better or worse answer.

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u/Birdflower99 Jan 31 '23

A biological female and her natural characteristics is what a women is.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

So a woman is a woman. Gotcha thanks.

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

My question is “what’s the point”? I think we all know what a woman is. What fascinates me is Matt Walshes DAILY obsession with the topic, and many other “conservatives” too. Who cares? There are really very few trans people, none of who seem to have ill intent.

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u/MurphysMagnet Jan 31 '23

There are really very few trans people, none of who seem to have ill intent.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/transgender-woman-rape-scotland-mens-prison-nicola-sturgeon-uk/

https://www.floridatoday.com/story/news/education/2022/08/19/transgender-sexual-assault-report-bathroom-brevard-randy-fine-fdoe-could-bring-new-state-rules/10356216002/

https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/nj-trans-prisoner-impregnated-2-inmates-transferred-mens-facility-rcna38947

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/oct/13/alleged-rape-teen-girl-school-bathroom-tests-mcaul/

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

Oh lookie! Some random crimes that may / may not involve genuinely transgender people! The prison one was all consensual, btw.

Fascinating thst you keep these links handy

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u/MurphysMagnet Jan 31 '23

Are you saying that there is a minimum requirement for someone to identify as transgender? I was told that anyone can identify as whatever they feel like on a given day. I wasn't aware that there was a standard that marks someone as genuine or not-geniune in the trans community.

I only replied because you used the word "none" which isn't accurate.

Fyi, those are pretty specific crimes. I wouldn't call them random or downplay rape.

Fascinating thst you keep these links handy

There is this thing called Google. It takes keywords and allows you to search, using those words, for information on the internet. It is really handy and it only took about 8 seconds to find those links. You should try it sometime.

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

The bullying of a very small and misunderstood community is gross, and it’s one of many reasons why younger people vote for Democrats. The entire concept of “gender” seems to trigger a lot of angry old white men. I’m not sure why.

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u/MurphysMagnet Jan 31 '23

Nice try, but disagreeing with you and throwing liberal talking points back at you doesn't make me a bully, racist, phobic, or any other weak label you want to assign. The label does show that you don't have much of an argument, though. Which most of the people that come here to spout off don't, so I'm not really surprised.

Younger people vote Democrat because they don't know any better. Give them a peak behind the curtain, and they would be sickened by most politicians. The funny part is that the politician to actually support the LGBT community most was Trump. Most people are just too stupid to realize that and watch way too much CNN or MSNBC to actually ever hear the truth.

Gender doesn't "trigger" me, and I'm not angry or old. Again, nice try with the labels. If you don't understand why people are bothered by any of this, then you haven't been listening or paying attention. Once you start messing with kids, people have a problem. It really is that simple.

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u/Birdflower99 Jan 31 '23

Perhaps you don’t have school age children. There was once very few trans people. But now, it’s the cool thing to do. There are so many trans kids at my daughter’s middle school it’s sad. The point is that we don’t want this fad going on longer. It only causes an identity crisis, depression and other concerns like grooming for our children.

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u/Whatevah007 Jan 31 '23

It’s definitely a fad, mostly driven by tik tok and other social media, not the school or teachers. None of those kids are likely to actually transition and it’s all stupid puberty stuff

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u/Birdflower99 Jan 31 '23

I agree. But in my experience the teachers are encouraging of it and go out of their way to accommodate the LGBT kids over non-LGBT kids.

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u/Blueit613 Jan 31 '23

I couldn't agree more. There are only two issues regarding trans people I think are relevant to the greater public. Medial transition for kids, and those who want to destroy the gender binary all together. The definition of a women seems like such a boring hill to die on, but yet here we are.

A question I had about the "what is a women " documentary Other Daily Wire Members