r/apple • u/Century24 • Jan 18 '24

YouTube and Spotify Won’t Launch Apple Vision Pro Apps, Joining Netflix Apple Vision

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-01-18/youtube-and-spotify-join-netflix-in-not-launching-apple-vision-pro-apps?utm_source=website&utm_medium=share&utm_campaign=copy
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856

u/Quaxi_ Jan 18 '24

They added the feature in a way that would require Spotify to forgo their Connect feature in favour AirPlay 2. Apple did not want to implement Spotify Connect the way say Sonos, Google, or Amazon does.

Apple wants people in their ecosystem, and Spotify wants people in their.

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u/[deleted] Jan 18 '24 edited Jan 19 '24

This. I always belive there is something in Apple's API may leak Spotify's user statiscs info so Spotify will never adopt it.

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u/inconspiciousdude Jan 19 '24

Or maybe it's some stats that Spotify wants that Apple doesn't want to allow.

On another note, I tried playing some music on Spotify from Apple TV to HomePod the other day and it sounded terrible compared to Apple Music, even with a Spotify Premium account. Not quite sure why.

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u/timelessblur Jan 19 '24

Another one is Apple api does not feed back required info for Spotify agreements with the rights holder.

Like they would need to know which user playing what so they can charge the right amounts.

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u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24

[deleted]

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u/itsjust_khris Jan 19 '24

There's no way you'd hear the difference from a Homepod, it's more likely that it was re-encoded very poorly from the Apple Tv to the Homepod.

Even professionals cannot reliably hear the difference between lossless and well encoded lossy files.

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u/xeio87 Jan 19 '24

That digital/analog record scandal in the record scene a few years back was absolutely hilarious to read about. The purists couldn't tell the difference and the company that was making them was even highly recommended. 😂

The audiophile scene is weird.

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u/FlyingLap Jan 19 '24

I can tell but only with headphones. It’s more compression that I think people are experiencing and calling it “sound quality.”

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u/guitarer09 Jan 19 '24

And the majority of people don’t have the gear to hear the difference between a a 320kbps Ogg Vorbis track and a lossless FLAC track. I have a pretty decent rig, and yet the differences are so minute, I’ve switched to 320 almost entirely. I’ve gained drive space, and haven’t at any point in the last year felt like my listening experience has lessened.

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u/BodiesDurag Jan 19 '24

So you’re telling me all that Spatial Audio crap on Apple Music is just a gimmick?

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u/Meowingtons_H4X Jan 19 '24

Are you referring to atmos/5.1 mixes? If so, no that’s different - albeit you’d need a device that can reliably playback (or simulate) a multi speaker setup to hear that properly.

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u/mittortz Jan 19 '24

It's insane to me that you're getting upvoted for this - sorry - but there is absolutely no way in hell that anyone can tell the difference between lossless and high-bitrate compressed files of any kind on their homepod. It's 100% marketing unless you're listening on an extremely high end soundsystem/headphones. It is certainly not the difference they're hearing.

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u/zNz__2321 Jan 19 '24

+1 that lossy / lossless is unlikely to be the root

On the other hand, Apple Digital Masters is what I suspect. Anything that is mastered based on Apple's guidelines gets the "Apple Digital Master" label, which does bake in a lot of psychoacoustics into the music... aka the music has been mastered to sound better to begin with. I'm not sure if Spotify has an equivalent that is as mature.

Nonetheless, I would not be surprised if HomePods are doing some light processing (ie taking into account the sound reflection of your environment, knowing the Digital Master parameters, etc) that will be more pleasing to you

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u/Thechosenjon Jan 19 '24 edited Jan 19 '24

lossless means nothing if it's used over a wireless Bluetooth device, that would still be lossy

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u/cdbaker Jan 19 '24

That is categorically untrue. You're confusing the transmission method with the medium. The most common bluetooth standards don't support lossless - but that doesnt mean there isnt a mechanism for wireless delivery.

If your statement was true, it would mean you couldn't listen to lossless audio over wifi.

In the case of spotify, or any service, there is nothing stopping them from streaming any quality of audio to the speaker for direct playback from the device.

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u/Thechosenjon Jan 19 '24

I was unclear, my fault, I meant over a wireless bluetooth signal like phone to earpod/ headphone or via wireless speaker connection. I understand that lossless audio is possible over WiFi via Apple Music as ALAC format and TIDAL as FLAC for example, but not sure if the apple TV to homepod the original comment mentioned would still lossless

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u/likamuka Jan 19 '24

AirPlay is lossless since about 10 years now.

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u/DanTheMan827 Jan 19 '24

AirPlay was always lossless even back when it was still called AirTunes though.

Compressed with the Apple Lossless audio codec, but limited to 16-bit/44.1KHz

https://web.archive.org/web/20110329021254/https://www.apple.com/pr/library/2004/jun/07airport.html

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u/deniableplausibility Jan 19 '24

Over something like Bluetooth, sure. Over WiFi, not necessarily (which would be the case if you ask Siri on HomePod to play something from Apple Music — the file would stream directly to the HomePod). Whether or not the HomePod’s DAC can actually handle anything above 24/48 is an entirely different question (and I’ve seen conflicting info on that…technically the chip they use should support up to 24/192, but that could be gimped by software).

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u/Thechosenjon Jan 19 '24

Yes, I meant over bluetooth

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u/ascagnel____ Jan 19 '24

HomePods specifically don’t accept audio via Bluetooth — you have to use AirPlay, which runs over WiFi.

As a general rule with speakers, if you don’t have to pair it, it’s not connecting via BT.

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u/DanTheMan827 Jan 19 '24

Well, that’s not entirely true… if you take a lossless file and encode it to a lossy format for Bluetooth, that would be one lossy encode.

If you take an already lossy file to transmit over Bluetooth, you’d add another lossy encode on top of the one you already, so even more data is lost from the original.

Although, if the source format happens to be compatible with the Bluetooth headphones, it could just be sent directly without any re-encoding. I don’t know if iOS does this though. EQ would throw that out the window though because that would be modifying the audio data necessitating re-encoding it again

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u/Fullyverified Jan 19 '24

That's not it at all. The difference between lossless and high bit rate ogg vorbis is basicly Impossibly to hear.

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u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24

Spotify doesn’t have lots of data that’s Apple doesn’t want to allow if there is Spotify doesn’t want Apple to collect to😅

I have high end speakers and when I set Spotify to high quality I don’t notice much difference. even in audiophile sub people don’t notice lots difference either. This point is much weaker than Apple fans imagine /s

-1

u/CT4nk3r Jan 19 '24

I honestly think its more likely that spotify leaks user data... spotify still doesnt have 2fa

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u/CountSheep Jan 18 '24

A superior feature too. AirPlay is trash in comparison

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u/rootbeerdan Jan 19 '24

I hate how right you are, AirPlay is good but the UI is so poorly designed that unless you actually understand what AirPlay is doing under the hood you aren't going to have a good time doing anything that isn't a single tap.

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u/SleepUseful3416 Jan 19 '24

AirPlay sucks dick. The delay is unacceptable in 2024. It’s dumb as shit too. Spotify Connect on Alexa always works instantly and reliably.

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u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24

[deleted]

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u/-ContainedChaos- Jan 19 '24

I have Apple Music which doesn’t have an equivalent connect feature but even I know this is such a bad take

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u/LUHG_HANI Jan 19 '24

Not sure why you can't but I just tested playing a downloaded song from Spotify with no internet. Works fine.

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u/bad-at-maths Jan 19 '24

I’m guessing you didn’t test it correctly lol. Spotify themselves are open about this on their community FAQ.

Playback of local files does not work through spotify connect when you have no internet. Source: https://community.spotify.com/t5/FAQs/Local-Files/ta-p/5186118

Playback of downloaded files does not work through spotify connect when the speaker has no internet. Source: https://community.spotify.com/t5/Android/Can-Spotify-connect-to-a-device-whilst-in-offline-mode/td-p/5522567

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u/LUHG_HANI Jan 19 '24

Ohh I see. Sorry, I didn't try connect.

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u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24 edited Jan 19 '24

Ehem, Apple Music struggles more with internet bandwidth than Spotify. Used both. If you live in an area with bad reception, AM is a no go.

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u/Ok-Study2439 Jan 19 '24

Lossless is useless for like 99.9% of music listeners

0

u/bad-at-maths Jan 19 '24

its still a good thing to have

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u/JoinTheBattle Jan 20 '24

Sure, but it's not worth making a fuss over.

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u/sloth2 Jan 19 '24

There's a downloaded folder and you can do airplane mode in a pinch

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u/bad-at-maths Jan 19 '24

nope, spotify connect does not work with local files even when imported to the app

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u/sloth2 Jan 19 '24

We’re using different definitions of downloaded I think

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u/bad-at-maths Jan 19 '24

what definition are you using? love to learn

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u/sloth2 Jan 19 '24

Download from the Spotify app to my device as opposed to local download files

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u/bad-at-maths Jan 19 '24 edited Jan 19 '24

Oh thats what I was referring to when I wrote

You can’t even play audio that you have downloaded to your device from the spotify app

Spotify Connect only allows streaming directly from spotify servers, you can’t play from your device.

It doesn’t work with local files either - so Spotify Connect can’t play downloaded songs no matter how you spin it

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u/deepsmooch69 Jan 19 '24

How is it superior? And how is Airplay trash? I never had any issues whatsoever with Airplay

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u/ShinyGrezz Jan 19 '24

I can sit with my headphones connected to my Windows PC and use the media controls of my MacBook to control it. It needs no wrangling and it happens instantly, without fuss.

Not to say that AirPlay is trash. But Spotify is just insanely effective at this one simple thing.

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u/tacotimes01 Jan 19 '24

It’s best feature is the stream is initiated on the connected device and CAN be controlled elsewhere. AirPlay just feels like wifi Bluetooth. You disconnect or walk away, no more stream. Connect just keeps going.

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u/DanTheMan827 Jan 19 '24

AirPlay 2 works like you’re describing. Only the first generation has a continuous stream coming from the device.

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u/alex2003super Jan 19 '24

Not necessarily true. Yes, AirPlay 2 works much better than AirPlay 1, has extremely low latency, seamless multi-room, lossless audio.

But the scenario you are describing where the player itself keeps streaming audio from the source over the Internet without the need for the iPhone to be present only happens when you "hand off" playback from your iOS device to your player, a feature only supported by HomePods and Apple TVs. Normal AirPlay 2 players like Macs, Sonos devices, soundbars, Hi-Fi amplifiers et al. won't be able to keep playing Apple Music without your iPhone involved.

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u/tacotimes01 Jan 19 '24

Hmm ok. I use nothing but AirPlay for a few years and if I AirPlay from phone to Sonos and close the music app, music gone. If o leave the house, music gone. Spotify kept playing when I left it closed the app, and when I opened the app, I’m remote controlling the Sonos.

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u/DanTheMan827 Jan 19 '24

Then Spotify probably doesn’t even support AirPlay 2.

If I AirPlay from an iPhone to the Apple TV with Apple Music, it keeps playing even if I turn on airplane mode on my phone.

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u/tacotimes01 Jan 19 '24

Hmm I haven’t used Spotify for years. I’m talking about Apple Music air playing via airplay 2 to a Sonos system.

You are right about Apple TV, so I guess Apple AirPlay 2 works like Spotify connect on only Apple devices. Spotify connect works like your Apple TV on Sonos, PCs, whatever.

Walled garden.

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u/DanTheMan827 Jan 19 '24

Depending on your Sonos hardware, it might also just not support AirPlay 2.

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u/BelgianWaffleStomper Jan 19 '24

I have both and agree it’s superior.

I appreciate that I can quickly change between and sound output source and it’s built in the software. It’s seamless and works far quicker that AirPlay, which always seems to give me trouble with my Roku TV.

It’s also a feature that can be controlled on multiple devices at once and I don’t have to be on the same wifi network.

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u/mediumwhite Jan 19 '24

Does Spotify Connect work without an internet connection?

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u/bad-at-maths Jan 19 '24

Nope. Spotify connect is essentially just your internet connected speaker streaming directly from the spotify servers(and nowhere else). Your spotify app is just the remote control.

It’s clearly a much less comprehensive feature than Airplay but it works well, especially the sharing.

Calling it a better feature is stretching it though imo. It’s like saying using Heelies is better transportation than a car because they are easier to carry around.

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u/rr196 Jan 19 '24

Nostalgia just came flooding in. Would it be weird that I just want a pair to throw people off now, like how is he gliding around??

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u/JoinTheBattle Jan 20 '24

Heelys are still very much a thing. Just saw a good gliding around in a pair at Target a few days ago.

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u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24

It works and switch audio input much faster than apple’s airplay.

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u/BelgianWaffleStomper Jan 19 '24

Yup, in my experience it’s a much more seamless experience.

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u/torrphilla Jan 19 '24

Spotify Connect is more seamless and supports more devices than AirPlay. It also recognizes when a device on your account is playing music and allows you to control it on your phone.

AirPlay is fine for me too but only when I connect to my Apple TV. If I am on my Xbox, iPad, or computer, I cannot connect and control my music from my phone the same way I can with Spotify Connect. The seamless process and integration over Wi-fi is so simple to use and yet so easy for Apple to adopt to make AirPlay better — they just don’t want to.

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u/deepsmooch69 Jan 19 '24

I am not sure the theory that it support more devices works in real life - both my LG and Samsung TV's support AirPlay while prior to reading your post I did not even know that there is such a thing as Spotify Connect. Airplay also support video which Spotify Connect obviously does not.

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u/c010rb1indusa Jan 19 '24

Your LG and Samsung app do support Spotify Connect you have to download the app from their respective smart tv app stores. Then you sign in with your spotify account on our TV and it will show up as a Spotify Connect device on your phone (or anywhere else you have spotify). Not sure if the app has to be open on the TV for it to show as an available device but I know it works via connect if it's open.

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u/torrphilla Jan 19 '24

But it’s about playing music, not videos. Even though AirPlay can play videos I still think Spotify Connect is better—and I am currently using Apple Music. 🤷‍♂️

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u/JCWOlson Jan 19 '24

Yeah, and to back up your point everything else is running the same kind of technology for both audio-only as well as video. My Android phone can control the volume and playback of anything connected to my accounts for any device I'm logged in for - except Apple stuff. Spotify, Google Play, Netflix, everything else plays nice. I used to be really tech savvy, but at this point I don't even know how each thing works because the controls just show up on my device regardless. Being halfway between two worlds sucks in that you can see what each is doing well and you wish that everybody just played nice. I don't think I'll ever give up Apple completely but they're sure not making it easy to stay with them

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u/torrphilla Jan 19 '24

They want everyone to be walled in with their products. I’m sure you know that. Easy for those who have grown up using the products, hard for literally everyone else.

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u/JCWOlson Jan 19 '24

Right? Somebody switching into the ecosystem is pressured into not just buying a phone, but replacing their earbuds, headphones, watch, desktop, laptop, tablet, and now even VR set, alongside their subscriptions to everything. It's crazy

2

u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24

Not sure. But all my devices like smart speakers and tv which supports AirPlay also supports Spotify connect except apple’s HomePod mini.

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u/ThankGodImBipolar Jan 19 '24

I doubt most Spotify users know that they have “Spotify Connect” either, because it’s barely a marketable feature in and of itself. Switching from playback on one device to another works exactly how you’d expect it to - it instantly picks up where you left off and switches extremely quickly. The pnly reason this is unique is because it’s hard (for some reason) for every other streaming service to figure out.

video which Spotify Connect obviously does not

It’s unclear to me why this is relevant but it’s also false - if you’re playing something on Spotify with video content (select podcasts?) and switch devices, the new device is going to pick up the video in the same place that the audio does.

3

u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24

Most Spotify users are not familiar with Spotify connect as well as airplay/ But most Spotify users know they can control desktop Spotify from their phone. ATM apple music user can only airplay from phone to Mac and its sending audio streaming to desktop. This is inferior experience.

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u/mediumwhite Jan 19 '24

It’s not hard, it’s a patented feature that Spotify owns.

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u/c010rb1indusa Jan 19 '24 edited Jan 19 '24

Airplay is actually sending the media from w/e device the source audio is coming from i.e your phone, to another device i.e smart speaker either via bluetooth or wifi. That means if you go out of range, change networks etc, get a call, the music stops playing/has issues.

Spotify connect acts as remote for another spotify client that your account is linked/signed into. When you play something on smart speaker via spotify connect on your phone, you aren't sending any media from your phone to the smart speaker. The smart speaker itself is connecting to spotify service via the internet and your phone is just used as a remote for it. That means playback isn't dependent on your phone, it won't stop or have issues when you go out of range, you can take calls, you don't even have to be on the same wifi network etc.

0

u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24

And they both have competing music services so there's that.

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u/[deleted] Jan 19 '24

Which is crazy because I’m deep in the Apple ecosystem and use Spotify connect constantly without issue. I didn’t realize there was this situation.